All aboard the Muss Bus

Speaker 1: 0:00

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Speaker 1: 0:43

Welcome to the Dunk City Podcast. Okay, welcome back to the Dunk City Podcast brought to you by uscbasketballcom. The first podcast in the Eric Musselman era because that is the big news of the last couple weeks is that Andy Enfield has moved on to SMU and USC has hired Eric Musselman, formerly of Arkansas and Nevada and the NBA, to be the head coach. He was introduced, I believe it was last Friday at a press conference. He had a very, I thought, successful press conference, such as those things go. He's been through many of them. He's a seasoned veteran so he knew how to handle the questions and he seems like he's raring to go here at USC Mark, what do you think about the hiring of Eric Musselman to replace Andy Enfield?

Speaker 2: 1:52

Well, first I'm just going to come in hot and I'm just going to say are you ready to apologize? You, chris Houston? Maybe, Well, we were in a dark, dark, a dark place last time we spoke and you uttered the name Bobby Hurley, so I think you just take 10 seconds here to say sorry.

Speaker 1: 2:12

Well, I said this was a guy who we should not hire. That I thought you know could get you know, agents can do amazing things in college athletics, you know, as we've seen, very fair A little bit of suggested ideation, though that got me a little concerned and really took me to a bad spot, but we'll be positive and move forward.

Speaker 2: 2:30

How's that sound?

Speaker 1: 2:31

That sounds great. Eric Musselman has four sweet 16s under his belt, three of them at Arkansas, one of them at Nevada, so he's a guy who does knows how to do well in the postseason. He's had multiple 20-win seasons at both of those schools as well. He doesn't seem to stay very long at his schools and it remains to be seen how long he's going to stay at USC. Obviously, one thing going in USC's favor is that he is a SoCal guy.

Speaker 1: 3:00

He grew up in San Diego, he went to the University of San Diego and he seems to like the SoCal lifestyle and his family seems to be really enamored with this move as well. Certainly, moving from Fayetteville over to LA seems like a pretty nice upgrade. But I think that, yeah, there's a lot of positivity going around the program right now, which is to be expected when they make a big hire. But I thought we would go in first to introduce to our listeners a little bit about what Eric Musselman is when it comes to the analytics of basketball, and for that we have Mark here to break down some of the history of Eric Musselman to break down some of the history of Eric Musselman.

Speaker 2: 3:46

So, yeah, what I wanted to do is you know, whenever something like this happens, I first just kind of wonder from a metric standpoint, what can we learn from prior situations? So if you want a little more color and detail on this, go ahead and look at the, at the, the last two columns that I've I've written on the on the website. So looking at basically when his when he is going two jobs back to when he took over at Nevada, um just did an incredible job. The Nevada team that he took over um had as a team this is just an absurd. Their team BPO 100 was 38.8 um, which it just I, I it's hard to illustrate just how, how dysfunctional that is. Just just think of, I guess you know, I guess, five people that over the season played at that that errington pages level, with all the the ups and ups and downs and primarily downs, um, just five of that, consistently, that's kind of a rough watch, I think.

Speaker 1: 4:47

Very rough.

Speaker 2: 4:48

Yeah, so, and no disrespect to Mr Page, but you know he's a freshman. I don't think this was 12 freshmen that he took over. Yeah, so in the first year that Musselman was there, he took him from a 38.8 BPO offensively to a 46. Just, that's a an insane, insane improvement. Um, and then after that, from the next three seasons, from 46.0 to 52.3, 55.3 and 53.0. You know when your team bpo is, is, is you know, north of 52.

Speaker 2: 5:21

You are a serious problem offensively and that 2018 team at 55.3, I just I would not want him to have faced that team at all. Yeah, you know, defensively he improved them out of the gate from a 47.5 to a 44.9. You know, stayed there so very sound defensively. A little blip in 2017, but you know very sound defensively a little blip, um in 2017. But you know very good defensively and I think every season, if I remember correctly, um that he was at nevada, that same bpl 100 would have led the pack 12. Uh, just this this season.

Speaker 1: 5:59

That just concluded yeah, he seems to be very consistent, uh, in his production and you know we haven't. He hasn't really been anywhere long enough to where we can see it really, you know, fall off, although we did see hints of that last season at Arkansas. But college basketball has changed a lot since he was even at Nevada and the roster turnover is extraordinary. The roster turnover is extraordinary Record numbers of players in the transfer portal and Musselman's been very adept at rebuilding teams from whole cloth and just coming up with whole new rosters.

Speaker 1: 6:35

Now, most of the time that has turned out really well. But, as we saw last year at Arkansas, they went 16-17. It didn't turn out well and kind of similarly how it didn't turn out great for Andy Anfield at USC. So there are drawbacks to sort of the uh having to go through the portal uh, because you just never know what you're going to get in some cases or you don't know how the talent is going to mesh. So, uh, usc is obviously about to hit the portal hard. But Musselman has also talked a lot about recruiting SoCal hard in the high schools and with these great classes coming up in 25 and 26, that's definitely a great strategy.

Speaker 2: 7:16

Yeah, I just think, not knowing details of NIL money, especially the NIL money that he was dealing with at Arkansas versus his successor, I would think that this would be a better place to recruit to.

Speaker 1: 7:33

Yes, I was told by the previous staff that the NIL money this year was much more competitive than it had been in previous years. So they were already set to probably get some pretty good transfer portal guys in under Enfield. And it seems with Musselman because he's just sort of a maniac in the transfer portal I'm curious to see you know it's possible that when he got hired too he got the offer of more nil support as well, so curious to see how he can parlay that into some some great transfer portal entries in the coming days yeah, um, one thing.

Speaker 2: 8:14

So we talked about offense at nevada. I just I want to talk about the other side of it and you really kind of um put this in my brain. We talked about just the, the slip at arkansas last season. So in the four seasons that musselman was head coach at arkansas, this is just, this is just unreal numbers. The first four seasons, the average bpl 100 defense was, um, defensively, 42.7. The average the worst of those four seasons was a 43.6. That, that just that's way more stifling than than anything we've we've seen in the pac-12 for years. I think that's, that's better than even like peak, peak cronin, if you will. Um, you know there was a huge slip last season to 49.7, andi.

Speaker 2: 9:01

Here's one thing that that I thought of as I, as I was just doing the research for that column, I mentioned parenthetically that his buyout was a I think I'd say curiously, if not suspiciously low I think $750,000. Which makes me think that number one, he does have a track record of not staying too long at one job. One, he does have a a track record of not staying too long at one job. I'm wondering if he kind of had one eye out the door last season already with with a buyout that low and felt that he had kind of run his course at arkansas yeah, it seems like it um seems kind of similar to what happened with calipari at kentucky, yeah, and with and maybe with enfield at us to some extent.

Speaker 1: 9:43

All kind of similar situations where a portion of the fan base was sort of like kind of ready for them to make a move. They'd been there a long time, or at least maybe not. Arkansas didn't have a must for a long time, but he had been flirting with other schools for a while, so they were sort of ready to have a bit more certainty in how, ironically, they get Calipari. But yeah, it's interesting. I think in each one of these cases the coaches sort of looked at the situation and I don't want to say they, like you know, got out before the. You know going out got hard, got out before the. You know the getting going out got hard.

Speaker 1: 10:24

But I think that it was just a matter of of you're in a, you're kind of stagnate after a while in one place and you know you need to kind of recharge your batteries a bit and why you know why let yourself get fired. Because in each case you know USC, usc had a losing record, arkansas had a losing record, kentucky gets defeated in the first round. So you're looking at the next year for all three of those guys. If it wasn't up to snuff, they might have been fired. So it made sense for all three, to just go looking for greener pastures. I agree, and help me out on this.

Speaker 2: 11:02

I know this is a USC basketball podcast, but just kind of related so with that little circuit that you mentioned. I don't know if my math is right, but I think if Kentucky hires Kevin O'Neill, that kind of closes that loop, Does that make that a full trip?

Speaker 1: 11:17

Yeah, I think so Okay.

Speaker 2: 11:19

I'm sure that'll happen.

Speaker 1: 11:21

Yeah, I'm holding my breath, we're sure that'll happen. Yeah, I'm holding my breath, so, yeah, so it looks like Muscleman has a fresh start at USC. Enfield has a fresh start at SMU, calipari's got a fresh start at Arkansas. One of the first things that Muscleman needs to do at USC is try to revitalize the roster, and part of that is to try to get some of the commits that were committed to Andy Enfield to still come to USC.

Speaker 1: 11:48

There's a rumor out there right now that Trent Perry, who's the prize commit from USC's recruiting class, the All-American guard from Harvard-Westlake a rumor is that he might be coming back to USC after all. And also another potential rumor out there is that Isaiah Elohim, who, if you go to uscbasketballcom and look on, you'll see a recruiting emblem on the sidebar which just happens to have Isaiah Elohim dunking, because at one point I thought he might be coming to USC. He ends up going to Arkansas and it seems like he might still be coming to USC. He ends up going to Arkansas and it seems like he might still be coming to USC. So that picture has come full circle on USCbasketballcom. But this is the next sort of exciting part of the process is to see who's going to be on the team?

Speaker 2: 12:39

You said Isaiah, you made my heart skip a beat. Any Any inkling on Isaiah Collier?

Speaker 1: 12:46

Well, part of the contract with Musselman coming to USC is that there must always be an Isaiah on the roster.

Speaker 2: 12:52

Okay.

Speaker 1: 12:53

It's sometimes two. I haven't heard anything about Isaiah Collier, although it is interesting how there's been nothing from his camp yet and how he showed up at Musselman's press conference. Usually these guys, as soon as the season's over, they've already made their declaration. Maybe something's in the works. Maybe Collier wanted to wait and see what the situation was, because this year's draft is not very deep and it looks like even still he's not going to be a lottery pick. Potentially he can be. Maybe he works out well. But maybe he's thinking if I get another year under Musselman, I can improve my stock, but next year's draft is deeper, so he's got a bit of a question mark there. He will probably need around $3 million in NIL to stay, but maybe he takes a little bit less and and he tries to benefit from from Musselman's tutelage. I don't think it's going to happen, but it is kind of weird that we haven't heard anything about Collier going pro.

Speaker 2: 14:01

Yeah, I would think that he you know he was considered to be such a one and done that. There's probably just NIL considerations that weren't even a thought before he came aboard.

Speaker 1: 14:12

Yeah, well, he had his own NIL deal coming in, I think with Powerade, and certainly he could sign do another Powerade deal perhaps. He certainly has the ability to go out and get his own NIL deals. He doesn't really need USC to do that. So yeah, we'll see. I think that's obviously an intriguing prospect. If he were to come back, usc would have to be in a much better shape, would be seen to be as in much better shape, and if you potentially have Isaiah Collier and Trent Perry and Isaiah Elohim and some other good transfers coming in, you could certainly see that team being competitive.

Speaker 2: 14:54

And on that topic, then, just to kind of reset everything with the complete list of players that have not entered or declared that they will enter the portal. Does that consist of basically Harrison Hornery and Mr Gardner, or am I missing somebody?

Speaker 1: 15:13

Those are the only two right now that are not in the portal. Everyone else is in the portal. Now some guys can come back. Certainly. You know, I don't see anything wrong with going out there and finding out what what your worth is. I don't know, I don't know how many nibbles some of these guys are going to get, right, maybe they, maybe they'll get good nibbles, but in the end we'll see. We'll see what they decide to do. It's certainly possible that that that some of these guys could decide that coming back to USC is in their best interest.

Speaker 2: 15:49

Yeah, it's it blank canvas that we're looking at in terms of the roster, interesting. Just, you know I gave the big picture on the metrics of Musselman at Nevada and Arkansas and how he progressed. One thing that's extremely different is, if you look at nevada, he actually did a deep dive on the team that he inherited so there were, I think I see, like 14, 13 or 14, uh, players that actually played more than a couple minutes at the team that he took over at nevada. So he kept all but five um. Of the five that he did not retain, three of them never played college basketball again and two of them had exhausted their eligibility.

Speaker 2: 16:38

So you know, um, none were quote runoff, if you will right um, which is interesting, kind of similar at Arkansas too, in that only you had, he had five that he did not retain. One actually had declared for the NBA draft, daniel Gafford. Then he had one transfer to Tulsa, one transfer to West Virginia and one transfer to UT Arlington and then one that didn't play college basketball again. So more transfers, but really you know the core, except for the one, uh, mr Gafford, who declared for the NBA draft. You know the one, two, three, four, five, six. Next most productive players all stayed, so he he definitely had a core that stayed intact there.

Speaker 1: 17:26

Aside from that, that one which is very different dynamic from what we're looking at here- yeah, so so far, uh, like you said, uh, there's not a whole lot of guys coming back but we do have one uh addition to the team, josh cohen, a 610 forward who played for umass last year. He had originally agreed to go to arkansas to play for musselman. He must really like musselman because now he's coming over to usc. Had a look at his film. He's a kind of a throwback, kind of garbage pail post player. Good with his back to the basket. You could tell he's watched a bit of Kevin McHale in his career.

Speaker 1: 18:05

He probably I would compare his post game to sort of it's pretty good post game. I would compare it to uh where nick rikosevich's was as a, as a senior, where he's not really playing above the rim. You know rikosevich didn't really have great hops um, but he didn't really play. He doesn't really play above the rim but he uses guile and shiftiness and footwork to try to get his shot off and it's been pretty effective at the level he's played at so far. Again, you're not going to see him being like a— he's not going to be a big finisher down low, he's not going to be an incredible rim protector, but he's just a crafty blue collar post player and I think he probably projects pretty well to the big 10.

Speaker 2: 18:55

It's interesting you say that I was. I was trying to think of a Trojan comp. I didn't think of a Rakocevich. I was thinking and this is kind of a stretch, and this is a CPA trying to be a, an author. Here I was. I was thinking maybe Brian Scalabrini on a day when he doesn't have much lift.

Speaker 1: 19:15

Yeah, you know he doesn't have Scalabrini's ability to face the basket and sort of handle the. Scalabrini can handle the ball, but when Scalabrini did post up, I would say that they have a similar set of moves, although I would say that Scalabrini's repertoire of moves was more kind of NBA style, whereas Cohen's style is really just kind of taking it back further.

Speaker 2: 19:45

It's more yeah, yeah, it's like. I guess maybe I'm thinking like Scalabria unveils this YMCA game.

Speaker 1: 19:54

Right, right, I can see that yeah.

Speaker 2: 19:56

You know he actually Cohen actually. Only so for those who don't know, he actually played three seasons at St Francis in Pennsylvania.

Speaker 1: 20:06

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 20:07

Just dominated that league BPL 100s of 58.1, 55, and 56.8. Only attempted two three-pointers over those three seasons. Went to UMass. He actually thought he shot 32 three-pointers at 34.4%, which is kind of in that no man's land of. I'm okay with him taking it and the defense might be okay with him taking it, unless he makes a couple. So he's, he's got that kind of in his bag. You know the highlights I saw. He could, he could. Maybe I'm coming from a different perspective because you know the team that we just saw at USC. We talked about this a couple of times on the pod where we were just saying please, no big man, just stop. Just y'all stop dribbling. It's not going to end well. And so this guy looked to me like Larry Bird in the paint when it came to ball handling.

Speaker 1: 20:59

He has good hands, he can catch the ball, he's got good ball skills, so that's going to help us a lot. I've got a little bit of breaking news that just came across the wire since we were just talking about it. Usc Trojans freshman point guard Isaiah Collier will enter the 2024 NBA draft, he told ESPN on Wednesday. Collier, ranked as the 10th best available player in ESPN's list of top 100 prospects, will be represented by agent BJ Armstrong of Wasserman. So I think that's is that the same BJ Armstrong um maybe so.

Speaker 1: 21:30

anyway, he's going to the NBA, as we all figured he would. So Josh Cohen, you talked about him. We've also offered George Mason Mason's Keyshawn Hall, who is a great looking prospect. He's like six, seven, 240 and can shoot it A big looking guy. There's a few other guys that USC has been looking into as well.

Speaker 1: 21:54

Two-lane point guard Colby King averaged 10.4 points, 3.6 rebounds, 1.8 assists this past year. He played his freshman year at St John's. As you can see, not a big assist guy, but it seems to be more of a combo guard. And then, going down the list of potential players coming to USC, with Musselman, you have potentially Khalif Battle, who started out at Temple, played against USC, then went to Arkansas. He has entered the transfer portal. Also Jalen Shelley, a four-star forward out of high school who had committed to Arkansas.

Speaker 1: 22:32

I mentioned Isaiah Elohim earlier. There's also Northern Kentucky transfer guard Marques Warwick, who has cut his list to five schools, including USC. There's also Missouri, penn State, cincinnati Seton Hall averaged 19.9 points per game this past season in the first team All-Horizon League. Then there's UC San Diego transfer guard, bryce Pope, who was unofficially visiting USC on April 12th, according to sources. There's also Penn transfer Clark Satchert, and he has cut his list to eight schools, including USC, ucla and Cal.

Speaker 1: 23:07

And then there's Deshane Montgomery, the MAAC Rookie of the Year, who has set his first official visit and breaks down his final four schools, which are Mississippi State, georgia, ole Miss and USC. So if he wants to go outside the South he might go to USC. And then, of course, usc is also showing heavy interest in Missouri State transfer. Alston Mason averaging 17.5 points and 3.6 assists. So no shortage of available players. They say there's currently something like 1,400 players in the transfer portal, and there could be as many as 2,000 before all is said and done. So there will be a fair share of quality players out there to choose from.

Speaker 2: 23:48

I haven't checked them all out yet from you know just a number standpoint the northern kentucky guy really catches the eye in terms of his, his shooting. But and there's there's kind of a I guess I called a currency translation issue here between the ivy league and and the big 10. But my god, that that penn state guy can shoot the lights out of the ball. Oh my goodness.

Speaker 1: 24:19

This three-point shooting, this free-throat shooting, is just unreal. Yeah, absolutely. There's just a lot of good players in the transfer portal. I mean, of course, you know the portal is like it gives you heartbreak and then it salves your wounds because you know it giveth and it taketh. But it's just one of these things that's sort of hard to get used to in this, this era of college basketball.

Speaker 1: 24:36

But it is the reality and I think Muss is a coach who was made for this situation. He he talked a lot in his press conference about one of the things I like about. He talked a lot about walking around campus, being involved in the campus community. It seems like he's not just saying that because looking at his, his activities in Fayetteville at Arkansas, him and his family both seem to be really into being part of the campus community. It sounds like he's really into doing the same thing again here at USC, to doing the same thing again here at USC.

Speaker 1: 25:13

And I think and this is something that we didn't see there was a little bit of veiled reference to it in the press conference and I think maybe one of the complaints the administration had with Coach Enfield was that he had sort of stopped engaging with the campus community and I think if that was the case, then this will be a nice, nice change from that having a having an ambassador coach out there among the students. Sometimes you know, little by little, you get guys to come to the, to the games, and it becomes a thing, especially when the coach is talking to you or saying hi to you when you're walking down campus. So I like that and you know. One other thing I want to mention and get your thoughts on was we saw farewell notes from Chris Kapko and Coach Mobley, but we didn't see a farewell from Coach Enfield to the USC community. That's something I'm a bit disappointed at.

Speaker 2: 26:10

I didn't even notice that. To be honest with you, I wow, I just kind of assumed that it was done. That's interesting Wow.

Speaker 1: 26:20

Yeah, I didn't see any statement, Unless it's somewhere that someone else can find. I haven't seen any statement from Andy Enfield to USC. So it's a bit disappointing because, you know, but maybe he felt, you know, maybe he felt unappreciated at the end. It's certainly possible. So maybe the the departure wasn't completely you know, maybe less than fully amicable fully amicable. Yeah, I wouldn't say like you know, yeah, I would say it could still be amicable but maybe, uh, both sides were just ready for something new.

Speaker 1: 27:00

Neither fought to to keep it intact yeah, exactly, um, so, yeah, so, uh, it looks like I mean, this is what's gonna be really important to to help phil galen, because that's it's really the last element that usc is missing. Um, it's it gets talent now, it's got good coaches, it's got an arena, it's got media attention. The media is willing to pay attention to usc. It's just getting that, that atmosphere at galen and getting the crowds coming back, not just for curiosities, right, because because when people go to see LeBron, they're not cheering, they're just they're gawking. Right, you need people who are coming in and who are committed to the program and, like we talked about on the website, you know, creating a really diehard group of fans who are going to be out there making noise, supporting the team. And once you have that, that's just going to make things so much easier, because when, when the Galen center is, if Galen center is a hard place to play, that's going to probably win an extra game or two for you during the course of a year at home.

Speaker 2: 28:11

Agree, and that can make all the difference. You're dancing around this a little bit and I don't know if this is where you meant to go, even going back to engaging with the USC community. So my question for you is is the DJ a part of the muscleman era?

Speaker 1: 28:28

Ooh, that's a good question. Now, you know, if I had my druthers and no one ever has their druthers on them but if I had them he'd be gone.

Speaker 1: 28:37

Now I'm hoping that that Musselman's you know, musselman's been around the block a few times in college basketball. He knows what makes a great atmosphere. I'm hoping that he sort of takes a look at the atmosphere and says, no, we can't have this. That he sort of takes a look at the atmosphere and says, no, we can't have this, we need more of this. And you know, it would be great if he could.

Speaker 1: 28:59

I mean, obviously a lot of this stuff needs to be earned, like if the students start coming, but it would be great if the students maybe had a little bit better seating. You know where they can really be surrounding. You know really be harassing the other team. You know that's something that's probably a long-term issue. It has to do with with, you know, taking care of season ticket holders and all that, but.

Speaker 1: 29:26

But it would be great if, if, if, musk can go in and say, look, we got. You guys got to do it a certain way, because, because we're going to need to turn this place into an intimidating place to play, and so I hope they take a hard look at that. I don't think. I think the DJ is fine to a point, but I think the problem with the DJ is that he, he, he dominates the noise so much that he almost does he like it's hard to cheer over someone shrieking into a microphone, yeah, and so I think that he sort of makes the crowd lazier because they're like oh, we had the DJ to make stupid noises and do things.

Speaker 2: 30:05

Fair.

Speaker 1: 30:06

So I'm thinking, I'm hoping that they take a look at the DJ, but I mean in support of the DJ. It's sort of a. It makes the stadium unique, it makes the experience unique and it's certainly something that opposing players remember. But I don't think, unfortunately. I don't think it's something that is makes people dread playing there.

Speaker 2: 30:30

No.

Speaker 1: 30:33

Yeah, I think there's some pieces there.

Speaker 2: 30:35

But doesn't he do rams games too? That I have.

Speaker 1: 30:38

I seen that I don't know it's possible. He, he does usc football the resignation of your voice. Well, I would. I would just really like you know, and this is the old fart speaking, but but, you get a collegial atmosphere, that back and and have the.

Speaker 1: 30:54

You know the band. See, when the band used to come, the band not only makes noise with their instruments, they make noise with their, with their mouths, right, when they're not playing, they're, they're, they're cheering, they're like a dedicated cheering section. So what I've never understood is but the band, you know, when the band is given a backseat to the DJ and you see that there's less tribute to Troys being played, which is kind of again like a wear you down type of song which is supposed to, like you know, psychologically impact the opposing team and I think it used to back in the day. You know there's less of that. The band's not playing as much as they used to because they don't have enough segments. There's. The band's not playing as much as they used to because, because they don't have enough segments and uh, and I think that, uh, the band can can really be an annoying factor for opposing teams.

Speaker 1: 31:41

Like you know, the band where the band sits is is pointed directly at the opposing bench. So, if you know, during timeouts, when you're sitting there and the band's playing in your direction, it's hard you know it should be hard to hear what your coach is saying but instead you've got, like you know, the DJ doing the kissing cam or something you know, yes, you know. Like what is the point? Why are you here? You know.

Speaker 1: 32:06

Yeah, I guess maybe you're here to entertain, but aren't the players for that? Isn't the game for that?

Speaker 2: 32:12

Yeah, but but aren't the players for the? Isn't the game for that? Yeah, well, and he, he does act as kind of a cheerleader, I think I guess my feelings would be um, to really date myself here, since this movie is like about 25 years old, the dj's at a 10 and I need him at a four. Um, I think there's some, some value there, but just just a lot less of kind of the worst of it.

Speaker 1: 32:34

Yeah, I suppose I don't blame him. He's doing the best job he can. What he's being asked to do, he seems to be doing a fine job. I just don't think it's like. I don't know if it's like it's the kind of thing that you would have at an NBA game. The NBA game in gay out game out. The nba doesn't really, it doesn't really care whether, like, the crowd is making any noise, you know during the game like there's.

Speaker 1: 33:01

You go to an nba game and there's a little bit of cheering here and there, but everyone's pretty much there to gawk at the tall players, to gawk at the celebrities, to, like you know, look at the look at at the camp, look at the big screen and eat hot dogs and stuff.

Speaker 1: 33:16

Yeah, pay a lot of dollars for a soda yeah, exactly, and a beer that's just about to spill. But college is a little bit different. Right, there's a lot of students, there's more students in there. It's not supposed to be as glamorous, and so this idea that you know you need to come into a game and then have, like a dj, entertain you while you're sitting down, when it'd be better if, if, if, uh, you know, the place was handed over to uh, to the kids from animal house, and make, make the place a little bit more crazy.

Speaker 2: 33:51

Yeah, yeah. So maybe there's some kind of very memorable appearance or promotion that they have must do at one of the football games, since that's where you're going to have a bunch of students at one time, probably the biggest gathering.

Speaker 1: 34:09

Yeah, well, it sounds like he said he wants to go to, you know, as many sporting events as possible on campus, which is great, because when he shows up at, one of the things when I was working at USC was getting a lot of the team supporting one another.

Speaker 1: 34:24

I think is a really important thing. So when Mus is at the women's volleyball game or showing up at tennis, those people notice and so they're going to show up at basketball games and just every little bit helps. And I think the vibe I get from Muscleman is a little bit of a kind of a bit more intense Pete Carroll for basketball and that he seems to have. He seems to have that effusive nature and his ability to sort of like to motivate and get people fired up and he and he's sort of one of those guys that, um, you know Pete Carroll was, was fueled by Mountain Dew. His first three or four years he's got guys was mainlining Mountain Dew, um, and so, uh, I see Muscleman kind of the same way. Uh, and just sort of like, by the time Pete Carroll got to USC, people always thought he should have been more fit for college.

Speaker 1: 35:27

And I think Musselman was the same way where he kind of realized that, even though he was in the NBA, college was his proper home, because the kind of things that happen at colleges are things that interest him, things that excite him, things that get him going. So what's great is that this guy, you know, I don't know how sincere he is, but he knows how the game is played. You know you come to a college campus, you are part of that campus, you support it, you get involved and it sounds like that's what he's going to do, and I think that should pay some huge dividends for USC. I think you'll start to see Galen become more filled Cool. So any other thoughts on the hiring of Eric Musselman as the 25th head coach in USC basketball history?

Speaker 2: 36:07

No, just the one thing that stood out to me and I was looking at, just, you know, at Josh Cohen. My first thought and just there's a recalibration here my first thought was let's see how this translates to the packed Oops, nope, let's see how this game translates to the Big Ten, and going to be a lot of that. You know, I've got just mental pictures and feels for what a conference game has felt like for years and years and years and I don't have that going forward. So you know, the new roster is going to really just it's a blank canvas in terms of everything New roster, new coaching staff, you know, new conference, new context new everything.

Speaker 1: 36:45

Yeah, watching Purdue play Connecticut last night my wife said who are you cheering for? I was like, well, I've got to cheer for my conference.

Speaker 2: 36:52

Yeah, likewise.

Speaker 1: 36:59

I guess I'm cheering for. I was like, well, I gotta cheer for my conference. I guess I'm cheering for purdue, uh. But uh, yeah, it's interesting because we've got a coach from arkansas in the sec who is coming to the west coast to play in a big 10 schedule. So it's it's definitely an interesting um situation and it's going to be very exciting. I think there are some exciting times ahead for USC basketball. I don't know, like we've talked about, what the long-term prospects are for USC, and by long-term I mean after five years. To me, Musselman in addition personality-wise to being sort of a Pete Carroll type, a more intense Pete Carroll type as a basketball coach, I would consider him like a poor man's Larry Brown. Larry Brown was the master turnaround guy and he would. He'd show up at a school and almost immediately they become good. And then just when you thought like you know, oh, wow, they're going to be good, Then he's like OK, I'm off to the next. You know, he's like my work is done here.

Speaker 1: 37:56

He's like a cane roaming the earth.

Speaker 1: 38:02

But yeah, musselman's a little bit like that.

Speaker 1: 38:04

He comes in with the big, with the exciting veneer and the shtick and you know, most of it, I'm sure, is real and some of it is also like, hey, this is, I'm playing a role.

Speaker 1: 38:18

But he comes in, revives a program, they get to heights and then at some point the some of it wears off a bit and maybe the newness that that spurs a lot of the innovation, a lot of the success, sort of becomes less interesting and then maybe at that point it's a challenge to try to sustain that. In previous cases he has tended to go on to the next place and sort of like how Larry Brown did. It doesn't stay long enough to see things deteriorate, which is probably a smart philosophy. If you look at in football, the Miami Hurricanes, they won their national titles under three different head coaches in the 80s and 90s and it was almost like each one they hired a great head coach and each one of them left before the rot set in because the rot always sets in, and so as long as you can keep hiring good coaches every five years, you get the benefit of the rejuvenation that happens when a new coach arrives.

Speaker 1: 39:16

So there's always a rejuvenation. There's always the new buy-in right. For that time the players will buy into the new coach and will trust the new coach, and it's only later on when they start to realize things don't always align with what the coach is saying, that they don't get the same kind of results. But I'm interested to see how musselman, how long he's going to last at usc.

Speaker 2: 39:43

I hope it's a long time I do too on at the same time, you're speaking to someone who's worked as a consultant for almost five years now, and I completely understand and live the dynamic that you just described.

Speaker 1: 39:57

Yeah, and I, and I get it too, as far as one of the great things about the situations you see USC is in now and one of the things I used to intone when people talked about getting rid of Andy Enfield was you know, be careful, what you wish for you can also. Things can also get worse. I think that Um Muscleman uh, on paper is a is a upgrade from Andy Enfield. Uh, he's. He's shown greater levels of success. Uh, with a far greater background. He's a little bit older. Um, he's just had more success and the odds are he's probably going to have more success in the next five years than than Andy would have. Um, there's no way of ever proving that that, but I think it's probably the case. But the good thing is that even if Muscleman has some success at USC and moves on, I think USC has shown that by hiring Muscleman that it's kind of a serious player in the coach hiring business.

Speaker 2: 40:56

Yeah, you know, that's one thing I think that's been illustrated by this whole thing is, you know, for years I think us diehards have thought geez, you know, this school is in a great place.

Speaker 2: 41:07

It's, it's, it's a really good school.

Speaker 2: 41:09

It's kind of somewhere between a diamond in the rough, maybe not a sleeping giant, maybe not an unpolished gem, but there's a lot of upside here that's unrealized and the constricting factors were basically, you know, the lack of a financial commitment and the series of athletic directors who just could not get out of their own way unless it was at the yacht basin. And now we actually have an athletic director who's a serious grownup and we have big 10 money. So I think we're a lot closer to actualizing a lot of that promise that we've been seeing for literally decades, just saying, boy, if things just fell into place. And a lot of the external factors have. Well, athletic department is internal, but a lot of that has fallen into place and I think a lot of that has to do. You know, anfield has nothing to do with the Big Ten money, but you know how do I say this Making, making the business case, I guess for a um, a commitment to USC basketball, is a lot easier when you've had the success that that infield brought us.

Speaker 1: 42:10

Right and what's going to happen is this year, aside infield, had some really good recent success and then, if you can, if you can assume that Musselman is going to take it from there and continue that success or at least surpass that success. Let's say so in the last four years USC has been to Elite Eight. Let's say USC goes to two Elite Eights in the next four years. You've now elevated USC's program up a notch. Elevated USC's program up a notch. The coaches you know will have the coaching position at USC will have more prestige as a result, exactly.

Speaker 1: 42:48

Because if Musselman goes to two Elite Eights in the next five years, like he did at Arkansas, then USC will have been to three Elite Eights in like a decade, mm-hmm. And if you go to three elite eights in like a decade, and if you go to three elite eights in a decade, you're probably a pretty good basketball program.

Speaker 2: 43:06

Yeah, and and well, I'll put it this way, I think you do a lot worse. And just ask the people at Arkansas is serving from a bridge as as a bridge for Mike Anderson to John Calipari. Now you're not getting Pete Calipari, but you know, I think there's a similar dynamic there of just, you know, taking a good program and making it just a lot that much more desirable with a lot of the resources. I mean, they have two huge boosters in the Walton family and the Tyson family or whatever they are, the chicken people. I'd kind of take our alumni against those two as a, as a as a whole, or a collective, if you will.

Speaker 1: 43:45

I would too. But you know, they have to care about basketball and and it really goes back to and to me, it wasn't the financial commitment wasn't there, for sure, but it wasn't because they didn't have the finances, it was because they just didn't see basketball Like the like guys, like like Mike Garrett, lynn Swan just they didn't really. They didn't really spend a whole lot of time thinking about how how can I get us good in basketball. It was just like how can I get us good in football? And oh yeah, we gotta, we gotta find someone to coach basketball, kind of thing.

Speaker 1: 44:20

You know, and and I think that that was the attitude with basketball through the entire time we talked about and about the misfortune of of having to have a program in the shadow of of woodens program over at ucla. And too many old trojans, too many many old USC Trojan athletes and fans are so used to being in the shadow of UCLA that they just didn't want to invest too much time into basketball because it was, it was like it, just there was no point to it. But now and too many of them don't realize that that we've now like we've gotten out of that we were. That's no longer the case, we're no longer in the shadow of UCLA, so we don't have to worry about that. And luckily, you know, we have a new athletic director who doesn't care about any of that old stuff, and so and so now we're in a great situation and and things look good, moving forward.

Speaker 2: 45:12

You don't think that the guy who thought it was a good idea to extend Clay Helton would have the secret sauce to USC basketball becoming its full self?

Speaker 1: 45:22

Well, he did hire. Andy infield right, or was that? Was that Swan?

Speaker 2: 45:26

Swan extended him.

Speaker 1: 45:27

I can't remember which which bad administrator from the 72 through 70 73 teams did that.

Speaker 2: 45:35

All right.

Speaker 1: 45:36

Well, that all said, it's time to uh get a move on here. Thanks everyone for listening and uh joining us at uscbasketballcom to discuss usc basketball. Very exciting times in usc basketball land. We got a new head coach, uh, and we're excited to see where everything, um, how everything pans out, and we're gonna keep an eye on things and we'll be back, uh, very soon, once we have a good idea of what the roster looks like. So with that, I'll say fight on and hand over you, mark.

Speaker 2: 46:06

As always, fight on everyone.