Speaker 2: 0:27

Welcome back to the Dunk City Podcast brought to you by USCBasketballcom. Chris Houston, here with Mark Backstrom and Sky Liam. How you doing, gentlemen?

Speaker 3: 0:36

Not bad.

Speaker 1: 0:37

Doing very well. I missed you guys.

Speaker 2: 0:40

Missed you. Our last episode was called Tailspin. We did that podcast back when, I think it was right after the Ohio State game perhaps, and before the Oregon game. We had a literal tailspin toward the end of the year, finished things off roughly but did get one last taste of victory against Rutgers it's kind of funny In two overtimes. We had talked in the previous podcast about the fact that USC potentially would be having its first non-overtime season since 2016.

Speaker 2: 1:23

The Trojans ended up playing in double overtime against Rutgers, limping toward the end of the season, finishing 16-17, of course, gave Purdue a hell of a battle, which of course is sort of a poetic ending to the year, because this was a team, for all its faults, never gave up, never packed it in To the extent that a team that fights hard packs it in. You might say that the level, the energy level toward once USC lost to Minnesota, I think the energy level and the sense of urgency that had buoyed the team in the middle part of the season or middle part of the Big Ten season had pretty much vanished and I think that going into that final game or that game against Rutgers and Purdue, there was sort of a recharging of the batteries before that Big Ten tournament, a sense of, hey, let's give it our shot. And the Trojans gave Purdue a great shot and really could have very easily won this if not for the Zebras. What do you guys think?

Speaker 3: 2:35

You know, there was one thing I was worried about with this losing streak at the end of the season. It wasn't that Musk didn't recruit well enough, because he's been a good recruiter everywhere he's been and I'm not really worried about his ability to recruit. It was the fact that, must you know, kind of seemed from an outside perspective that he might not have gotten his team totally on board last season and this season when it looked like, okay, are these guys kind of throwing in the towel? Is this going to be a trend where, like, players are tuning him out? And I was not feeling definitive on that, but I wouldn't be honest if I was to say I wasn't a little worried. And then they really just fought their butts off against Rutgers and against Purdue and they were really playing to win and I said, okay, I have no worries about this season.

Speaker 1: 3:37

Yeah, one thing I want to bring up just a little more specifically to your point when we were previewing candidates and then the hiring of Musselman about 11 and a half months ago I guess it would have been One thing that stood out to me was what a big step back his last Arkansas team took, specifically defensively. They were always defensively with a BPO of about 43 or 44. And last season it just spiked up to a 48. And this season the defensive BPO is over 50.

Speaker 1: 4:14

Now, very different, because you've got, you know, a totally new set of guys here and you know, honestly, you know, four years from now, how many of, if you look at the roster four years from now, how many of them will will basically look like what's on the team today. Or, put another way, how many, how many players on this team will start on. You know we'll start on the roster that we have four years from now, maybe, to put it another way. So you know these aren't probably ideal, um, ideally his players, um, but you, that's my concern above everything else, not really from the effort, but really the defense. This is two bad years in a row.

Speaker 1: 4:49

And you know, todd Lee, actually I don't know if you remember this? Before the season he said the single thing that he was concerned about last year, why they took such a big step back, was they didn't have size on the perimeter. I don't know if you remember this, chris. You said we had six, six or three guys, you know, making runouts and it just wasn't working and we didn't have that. But yet you know we had defensive problems, although our defensive problems seem to be more born of, you know, no rim protector as much as anything else.

Speaker 2: 5:19

Yeah, I don't think it was necessarily like this. You know, obviously they had breakdowns in defensive assignments just like anybody does when you're fatigued or when you're getting overwhelmed by the play of another team. But I think, structurally, most of our defensive liabilities were due to just the nature of positional deficits against other teams, whether it's speed on the perimeter or whether it's size down low. But I think the lesson of this season I hope USC basketball fans kind of take this lesson away which is that last year Andy Hetfield struggled or his team struggled, and it was really the first time his team had truly struggled since early in his career. Obviously, they had that 2018-19 season, which wasn't great. For the most part, the team was coming out with fairly well-balanced teams. There's a good stretch of bigs they were a perimeter team was fairly well-balanced teams. We either had well, there's always like there's a good stretch of like bigs, right, and then they went to kind of a perimeter they were a perimeter team, then they went to like a big oriented team and then they kind of tried to go back to a perimeter-oriented team with Boogie and Drew and never could quite get back to being that sort of like dominant backcourt. But I think there were a lot of USC fans who are really ready to jettison Andy Enfield, and I think we were all excited about Eric Musselman, and I'm still excited about it.

Speaker 2: 6:51

I think that you have to look at this year as a bit of a mulligan, the same way I look at Andy Enfield's previous year as a bit of a mulligan. There's a confluence of factors that just led to a bad year. I kind of take the point about him having the rough year at Arkansas and then back-to-back with the rough year at USC. But it is a shift going from place to place. It is a shift in recruiting priorities. It is a shift in recruiting pool. It's a shift in competition.

Speaker 2: 7:31

Uh, the sec is, you know now, the basketball conference as it turns out, and um, and so I would feel a lot worse if I didn't know that that muscleman has already uh corralled, uh, top seven recruiting class. Uh, still more to come. And now that we know that there's a couple guys who perhaps we weren't sure before but who might be coming back in Rashawn Agee, terrence Williams, so on and so forth, potentially. So I think that's you know, if USC didn't have like a group of great recruits in the back pocket ready to go for next year already, I would feel a lot more uncertainty. What was one thing I know we we can rely on, which is that Musselman will continue to just bring the energy, bring the you know it's. He's not going to lose for lack of effort, right? That's kind of how I see it.

Speaker 1: 8:23

Excuse me Absolutely. You know I just go into the other side of the ball of what I mentioned before. You know, offensively I've mentioned this a little bit and I apologize if I discuss this a lot, but when I was talking with my buddies in Scottsdale about a week and a half ago when they were asking me what the heck happened to your, your basketball team, you know, one analogy I think that kind of holds good is do you guys know the the? You know, when you're five years old, the, uh, the game concentration where you put on all the playing cards and you flip over a card. You try to match it with another one.

Speaker 2: 8:56

Yeah, and it kind of felt good. I played that the other day with my uh, my three-year-old.

Speaker 1: 9:02

I played it with my wife and probably you did better than I did. You know, I kind of have an analogy between that and basically how we were to defend. At the beginning of the season we didn't even know what we had. And then we had a good grasp around early January about what we had, and then it just seemed like other teams they kind of matched the jacks together and they said, okay, well, this guy can do this. And then that got taken away and the more cards that you got taken away, the easier it is to kind of go through the rest of the deck.

Speaker 3: 9:32

It just felt like that about like by mid-February.

Speaker 2: 9:36

Yeah, it's a great way to look at it. It's almost like once Big Ten season started. There season started there was a surge as the team came together a bit and then there was the deceleration, so to speak, as opponents sort of clamped down as Sky mentioned in previous podcasts guys sort of getting If you're 6'7" and you're out there, some 6. Omar Balu's pounding on you, sticking his ass in your gut, and your six and your Jabuzo Abo. That stuff wears down on you a bit. And then you know you go look at Wesley Yates. I mean, in his last nine games he averaged 39 minutes per game.

Speaker 2: 10:19

You know, some of these guys were, they were playing a short bench, some guys got hurt, but I think it really comes down to, in the end, when you look at it, losing Desmond Claude for those two games really seemed to put a. It's like the guy in Jaws putting the nails across a chalkboard, sort of like bringing the meeting to a close. That's sort of what it felt like. What do you think, sky? Do you think that's like when they do the history of this season, like for those who really keep an eye on these things, that the point where Desmond gets hurt and I guess that would be. He got hurt against Penn State was it?

Speaker 3: 11:06

He got hurt against Michigan State, but he finished that game and then he missed two games.

Speaker 2: 11:14

Right. So then USC lost to Purdue. Purdue was expected Northwestern could have been a win. I feel like that's like the Northwestern game ends up being a really pivotal game on the season because USC had had great momentum at that point, having beaten Michigan State and Illinois, and so losing to Northwestern in a game that I think was really winnable without Claude, and then of course losing Purdue, and then Claude comes back and he just, and then of course losing Purdue, and then Claude comes back and he just.

Speaker 2: 11:45

You know the combination of You're already looking at a delicate balance that had been going on with the starting lineup and they had finally figured things out, and that kind of delicate balance was disturbed, with Claude coming out and then he comes back in, and now you're kind of re-establishing things and he's kind of not quite. He's not quite the— there's like three games, I think, where he's not quite the explosive player. He had been before the injury, which is understandable, and then it wasn't until the very end when he sort of came back and was kind of more himself. Is that a fair depiction, sky?

Speaker 3: 12:22

Yeah, I was actually sitting in the second row behind the USC basket second half of that Minnesota game, and he had a chance to tie the game and the ball slipped out of his hands and I'm like that's not what Claude usually does. It really looked like either the injury was still bugging him or he was sick, and it might have been a little bit of both, because that was when this flu was going around the team.

Speaker 2: 12:49

Very bad flu season.

Speaker 3: 12:51

Yeah, that's true for everybody, and he just really didn't look himself until, honestly, I would say, until the Big Ten tournament and the team's offense becomes so clawed dominant. They lost Terrence Williams, who was one of the best three-point shooters and we've touched on this a little bit. But mus mentioned it was around the time of the ucla game that, uh, saint thomas had been battling through an injury and playing through that and for several, several games he had this KT tape on his shoulder and then he took it off and some other posters on the board mentioned that his shot looked really different. I think because he had games where he was scoring like two points a game. I think he had some kind of shoulder injury and if he ends up coming back to USC and we hear that he has an off-season shoulder surgery will it'll all make sense well, he wasn't even.

Speaker 2: 13:49

He wasn't even shooting at times, right, he just like, was not like he. It's like, um, he was like he was like Dennis Rodman out there, right, you know, he'd have the ball three feet from the basket and he'd like look for the open man. You know, you know it's. And so, yeah, it was like he was a bit of a At times. He looked like he was a bit of an Edsel out there. Didn't seem to be the case with his.

Speaker 2: 14:11

He played great defense, I thought, a pretty good defense most of the year, considering his range of opponents that he had to go up against, whether they were guards or big men. So I thought he was pretty good defensively all year and obviously always a very good passer, pretty solid rebounder. So he did a lot of things to his credit. But something wasn't quite there with his shot, although it's interesting. For much of the year I feel like he took, I feel like the first 10 games of the year he scored the first basket. He started this thing where he would score the first basket for the team. He started this thing where he would score the first basket for the team and then, once Claude, and later Yates, took over the scoring role. He just sort of receded into the background a bit and just kind of took things as they came.

Speaker 2: 15:00

And I think to some extent I don't know if it would have been possible for Claude and Yates to be as effective as they were had he been more of an offensive player, more assertive offensive player, but it wasn't like he was. He wasn't going. You know he's not like a pure post, you know he's not like a pure post guy, he's not a pure shooter, he's just kind of a guy sort of like plays a little bit of mid range and kind of I don't know, he just kind of manufactures points. But that's not really. It's not really something that could happen very, very easily in the flow of an offense that is being directed by someone like claude, like you mentioned sky, who was pretty much initiating the offense at some point. You know, toward the end, pretty much every play he was initiating the offense.

Speaker 3: 15:54

You know just really like he was the first option almost every play toward the end yeah, and I think it became a lot harder for Saint to kind of just take it as it is when he was playing against Big Ten defenses. You know he had some games like Washington. He scored really well and I don't have the stats in front of me, but I have to imagine he scored well against Iowa because everybody scored well against Iowa. But aside from that, I could score well against Iowa because everybody scored well against Iowa.

Speaker 2: 16:26

But aside from that, I could score well against Iowa.

Speaker 3: 16:29

Aside from that, he really didn't have in the Big Ten schedule as far as I can recall. He didn't have a ton of other big offensive outbursts, even his homecoming game at Nebraska in which he played well, he scored, I believe, 12 points.

Speaker 2: 16:46

Yeah, he played pretty well. You know he averaged nine points on the season, six boards, led the team in assists, just narrowly over Claude. So he actually led the team in rebounding and assists and actually rebounding assists and steals. And I think I had a stat earlier in the season I had come up with a note. I don't know if Sports Information has found that note, but I think he is the first player to do this, to lead the team in these three categories since the great Eric Craven back in 2002. That's pretty cool. Yeah, so we did something. Let's look at real quick just some of the other players, desmond. You know, let's kind of do like a round table on where you see this player, how they finished up, where you see them for next year. We got Desmond. Claude led the team in scoring 16.3 points per game, shot almost 50%, ended up 31.8 from three-point land, 77% free throw average, 3.5 boards, almost four and a half assists per game. Had a lot of turnover, especially late in the season.

Speaker 1: 18:07

That's the problem. Yeah, sorry, just real quick Between after the Michigan State game until the Big Ten tournament, over six turnovers a game. I think, that's the whole thing, right there.

Speaker 2: 18:21

And to some extent, a lot of that was, if you look at it, his fatigue, maybe his conditioning in some cases, and just not having the ability to explode and change direction and do the hesitation stuff that he was doing earlier before he got hurt. Any thoughts on that?

Speaker 3: 18:40

And I think a lot of teams just really closed down the lane for him and he's a good ball handler, but not a great ball handler. Similar to what you'd see with Wesley Yates. Sometimes, when he would really get caught up in traffic, he'd get his pocket picked a lot or dribble off his foot or something.

Speaker 2: 18:57

Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1: 18:59

McLean made a great point about that too, as is often the case. He said you know, it seems like teams have scattered him. They know exactly how to like, basically how to pick his pocket. You know he turns his back in some cases and teams expect that and they know that's, that's right and you can pounce, and I think that was probably. You know, if there's one little micro, micro factor, that might be it, it's like, you know, teams figured out how to really take advantage of a kid learning the position and because then I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna crush him. I mean, you know, god bless him for for doing that, god, who, what will you be without him?

Speaker 2: 19:30

you can step into that role, but that was rough well they, they did uh, like they did stop him and they didn't right, because he's still average, you know he was still has pretty good numbers for supposedly being figured out right, for being a, for being a one dimensional player and this is the intriguing aspect of being a one-dimensional. You know, he's a one-dimensional player. He's not a horrible three-point shooter, but he's not really somebody who the other team is worrying too much. If he wants a three-point shot he can find it and he can take it if he wants to. But he only, you know, attempted 66 three-pointers, which is like fourth most on the team. So it wasn't a priority for him. But this was a guy who had some dominant stretches of the game. Despite everyone knowing it was student body, right, he did pretty much. He was like I'm going to go down here and you're going to have to try to stop me, and sometimes he was able to sort of really be on his game and find the open man when he would get double teamed and really find it quick and with great anticipation. But I think, even though he struggled toward the end and the turnovers piled up, to some extent I think that the Desmond Claude that is healthy and energized and in good shape and not hurt, just like anybody, is a very intriguing player If he can keep improving his three-point shot, keep improving his passing ability, keep improving his handle.

Speaker 2: 21:01

This is someone who's a junior. He's got another year left if he wants it, and so I think he's still a promising player, not like a fantastic not really a fantastic defensive player, but I kind of get it, because they put a lot on his shoulders this year. He had to do a lot of stuff and you can't. You know, unless you're super human, you're not really going to get someone who's able to just you can't. You know, unless you're superhuman, you're not really going to get someone who's able to just you can't. You could do student body right on offense. It's really hard to do student body right on defense. Thoughts Go ahead.

Speaker 3: 21:35

Scott, I think it's going to be really interesting to see what his decision is in the off season. And you know I feel like these days to see what his decision is in the offseason. And you know I feel like these days, with the way the portal is, whatever the player's decision is let me put it this way If the player comes back, it's with the blessing of the coach. You know, you used to see kind of like, wow, this guy is just really riding the pine or this guy is such a not type of player that we hoped he'd be on the team and he keeps coming back. I don't think that really happens anymore. That being said, you do see some players leave a team against the coach's wishes sometimes, but if he stays, I mean everybody's all in Player, coach, I think.

Speaker 2: 22:33

Yeah, I think that's a really good point, you know, because we haven't really thought about that. Where it's like, when you think about player, like the old days, you wish you could get rid of a player quicker. Sometimes as a fan you're like man, this guy's not very good. We've got two more years of this guy. He's going to take up minutes for better players. So you're right, you know that if someone is there it's because the coach pretty much wants you there. So that actually gives you a better idea of how much, as far as shaping the roster, how much more flexibility coaches have now. So to the extent that where they don't have flexibility, it's just the fact that they may or may not be able to find the player they want for a certain position, sometimes they have to figure out do player they want for a certain position right Rather than uh, uh, you know, sometimes they have to figure out, you know, do I want to keep a guy who I may not, who may not be ideal, because is he better than the guy I might? You know? Is he better than someone I might not be able to get? You know, um, so, uh.

Speaker 2: 23:39

So, desmond Claude overall pretty good season, I would say on balance, Not a perfect season, but a really good junior, especially coming over, given all the situation with all the new transfers. He shot 169 times, most of the team. Wesley Yates, who is the next leading scorer, shot 164 times. These were the two.

Speaker 1: 24:07

You're looking at Bakes actually, Sorry.

Speaker 2: 24:10

Oh, you're right. You're right, he shot 340 times. Really, yates and Claude were almost even in the number of shots, which is actually interesting because Claude had a bit of a head start on the year as far as minutes and stuff like that. So really, if you start looking from about maybe a quarter of the way into the season, wesley Yates is kind of like the dominant player on the season as far as just being the main offensive player, finishes the year with really outstanding stats 14 points, which is a little misleading because I think he averaged really like 18 points from once he became a starter 47.8 field goal percentage.

Speaker 2: 24:50

44% three-point Almost a shade under 80%. Free throw Doesn't give you much on the rebounding or assist side, although he does show some slick passing skills on occasion. Second on the team in steals. So just a real scoring machine. Obviously someone who knows how to stay in the game and that's actually probably the key to many of his statistics is that he had a remarkable ability to play just tons of minutes without fouling out or being in foul trouble, and this enabled him to just be like a volume, volume score.

Speaker 1: 25:32

Yeah, really did. You know, what's interesting is is, just like the rest of the team, he actually his offense actually took a step back from in that last post Rutgers little segment. There His BPO dropped almost a full point, although in that same stretch he was second on the team in Buscar, which I think kind of speaks to what happened in the season is where the production came from. It came at a price. It was just a lot less efficient in getting those buckets.

Speaker 2: 26:01

Right, for sure, sky.

Speaker 3: 26:10

Yeah, I think honestly. Honestly, he's a player and I think everybody anywhere would agree with me that I'm really excited to see next year. All reports from various different sources seem to indicate that he will be back and you know, I'm honestly more worried about him possibly being drafted than transferring. But I think he is a competitor and a perfectionist and he knows that he's going to be able to excel much more if there's a couple facets in his game, like the turnovers, the handles, that he can clean up. He's mentioned before he wants to make an impact aside from scoring. So I think he had a freshman season that almost no one, except for maybe him, would have anticipated. It was fantastic and I definitely look forward to seeing him continue his development.

Speaker 2: 27:00

For sure, definitely one of the best freshman seasons at USC for a guard in a while. Yeah, from the perspective of you know, we knew guys like Evan Mulvey were going to be great and Yekyo Okongwu, but for him he kind of had the most unexpected really successful season I think we've had at USC in a while Because most guys were pretty much on radars. We've had it USC in a while because most guys were pretty much on radars. Which comes to our third player, chibuzo Abo. He averaged at the end 11.8 points per game shot, 41% field percentage, 39.6 from three, 86% free throw percentage. Actually averaged 4.5 boards. I think he was not putting up a lot of boards early in season but started to kind of make a bit of a jump in that toward the end. And you know, pretty even on assist to turnovers, I think third on the team in steals. Not a particularly consistent offensive player seemed to either be on or off.

Speaker 2: 28:06

I personally, I think in the end I guess I think I was a little disappointed in Abo's production overall in the year, just because when he wasn't getting his three-point shot or when he wasn't getting his attempts and especially when they weren't falling, he seemed to have difficulty finding other ways to contribute and there were times when, uh, he, he seemed to be prone to some defensive breakdowns and, uh, so I think there were just some times when it felt like he was, you know, like stretches of dead weight on the court and I think, to some extent, this necessitated the development of some other guys, some other guys being able to contribute. Um, but I think to some extent, this necessitated the development of some other guys, some other guys being able to contribute. But I think that I expected more from him on the year. I don't think it's a complete failure on the year, but I think maybe not where we hoped he would be.

Speaker 1: 29:05

I think with Abbo, I think that he runs so hot and cold that we almost take the hot for granted. We really get, we really get disappointed when he's cold. If you look, basically post Rutgers, he had the second best improvement in that final stretch of the season, behind only one guy, who we'll talk about soon, and actually was tied with Yates in terms of Buscar for that time period. You know, the thing is we, we just think I think he, when he's so hot, it's, it's just, it's just blistering hot, and I think the regression, the mean, is just so severe that overall you you're left, you know, I don't a lot of, it's just just kind of simple statistical regression, although it feels like you know what's going on here. It's just, it's just kind of variance, you know. Got to also say he had a lot of. You know Sky brought this up or maybe you did he had a lot of tough draws defensively. You know that's true, and he did win a few jump balls towards the end of the season, if I remember correctly too.

Speaker 2: 30:03

Surprisingly enough, yeah, he did Sky. What do you think? Do you think that you know abo was more than just a one-dimensional player, or do you think, on balance, that the other facets of his game ended up being positives, or just sort of, like you know, replacement level stuff?

Speaker 3: 30:25

you know what was odd, because you guys mentioned that he didn't seem to do a ton offensively aside from shoot threes. And I definitely remember early in the season and maybe early in big 10 play, there were times when he'd really get himself going by dribbling into a mid-range shot at the free throw line. He made some great cuts and it kind of felt like that fell away. I don't know if it was the way that teams were guarding him or what that might have been.

Speaker 2: 31:00

It seemed like confidence to me, it seemed like he was really, which is weird. Which is weird because he me, which is weird because I, you know, he had pretty much established himself. As you know he was there, wasn't going to be usurped as a starter, his starting spot was safe, he was getting his minutes, he was too good of a shooter to not get starters minutes right. There's just no way he wasn't going to play. So. So, in a sense, like you know I don't know why one would maybe.

Speaker 2: 31:32

I think, sky, you always talked about in the preseason when you, when you went to practice, how much, uh, coach must would drill into the players about not taking bad shots, not trying to eat, and it's kind of funny because is it possible that they drilled into it Some of these guys? Uh, because is it possible that they drilled into it, some of these guys to such an extent that St Thomas was reticent to take a lot of shots, and now we can praise them for taking good shots. For sure, the shot selection was there, but there are some times, like with Abo and Thomas, where you're like, you know, I think that was a good shot you just passed up, or I think that you could probably take this guy, and they just tended not to, not to try. I mean, you think that's a fair depiction of it?

Speaker 3: 32:15

Yeah, and I want to hear what you think about this too, mark, in my mind. Specifically, I remember the UCLA game at Galen, which was fairly early on in the conference season, I believe, and I specifically remember actually both Thomas and Abo. The offense was really kind of clunky in that game and it was kind of just guys taking turns trying to isolate and both of them were taking these like tough fadeaways that were not going and they seemed like both of them started taking less of those shots sometime after that game yeah, that's that.

Speaker 1: 32:55

That's a good point. Um, I, I can definitely see that, and if there's one thing that that bears out your point, I didn't even catch this. So so props for bringing this up. Uh, of the let's just refer to them as the end of the season rotation guys, kind of that group of seven or so the second worst shooter, just on two-pointers, was Wesley Yates, at exactly 50%. Below him was Abo, at 43.9% from two. That's just unthinkable and I think that really speaks to not like I can't shoot. The guy clearly can shoot and you know, usually you see this, guys who can shoot threes can make it once they get squared up, and that that seems to be a confidence in a shot selection thing as much as anything.

Speaker 2: 33:38

Yeah, and you know. The other thing is is that I think Thomas might've led the conference in like in bunnies or like really short close shot, like there was just a ton of shots that he had. I feel like there were, like for the first half of the season there was probably two attempts per game that were just like could have gone either way Right. Like you know, he could have averaged an extra four points per game during that stretch and I think this really affected his mentality. Things just weren't falling for him all season. Same with, you know, like some of these guys that didn't have, uh, I mean Thomas actually I think has. For the most part, it seemed like he has really good touches, he's like he's had shooters touch, but his shooters touch was failing him for large portions of the season and I didn't think like outside of like occasionally getting streaky from three point land, uh, abbo didn't really have a shooter's touch too often in the way that both Claude and Yates did, and when you have your next two players starting on the wings or whatever you want to call their positions, who are basically, for large stretches of games, really just sort of deferring to to cloud and yates, you're talking about a tremendous amount of pressure on cloud and yates, and also you're looking at defensive focus. Uh, it really helps, you know, if you're going five against two uh, and that really brings us to to the extent that it really wasn't five against two because of the emergence of of the next guy on the list and we talked about saint thomas earlier already but rayshon agey, who averaged 19 points a game.

Speaker 2: 35:14

Uh ended up uh, 8.5 points, shot almost 54, 41 from three uh. He shot almost as many three-pointers, three-point attempts, as desmond clod, so so it wasn't like a small amount. So he shoots 54 field goal, 41 three point, 75 free throw. Uh wasn't a big rebounder, uh, as far as uh pure volume, but average, you know, eight, eight rebound, 8.6 rebounds per 40, around that almost nine. And uh really ended up, I think, from the point he came on the podcast and we sprinkled the dust upon him and and and then pushed him forth uh into the world. From that point on he really I mean I haven't done the numbers, but he's probably the single bright spot for the last half of the season.

Speaker 1: 36:08

Yeah, for the you know, post Rutgers uh, first game segment he had the biggest increase in his um BPO by 1.4 points um, by far the best. He led the team in Buscar over that period too, yeah, um, which says a lot. Um also for the season of the end of the season rotation guys. So I'm kind of well, if we count half of matt noling, then noling takes this, but basically of the guys who play like serious minutes, ag was the most efficient from a bpl standpoint as well, um, so I don't know if basically somebody can relate to him. Um to get the word out among his teammates to please show up on the pod.

Speaker 2: 36:53

Right, yeah, exactly, uh, hopefully that that sparks a stampede. Uh, to come on the podcast, uh, sky, do you think, given Rashaan AG's strong finish to the season, is it? And given that I think we've been hearing that he, did you hear that he he had his uh extra year granted, or or is that something where they think it's going to happen? Is, what are you hearing on that one?

Speaker 3: 37:19

yeah, I don't think that there's any official position on the likelihood of it in my personal speculation I think terrence Terrence Williams is the most likely and then Agee, agee, you know, he'd be taking advantage, I guess, of a new rule waiving junior college seasons for eligibility because he only played, and then to further apply that his freshman year he only played one game right in division one, but because then later he played one season of junior college, that junior college year kind of took the place of that year in his eligibility. So if we wipe out that junior college year now, he can go back and say well, I only played one game that year. Okay, okay, we'll grant you that red shirt.

Speaker 2: 38:15

Well, when he started, when he started his college career, uh like Isaiah Elohim was like 12. So that just goes to show you, like how long ago this was. Uh, you know it's funny. I you know you talk about Terrace Williams and we're talking. You know, people are talking about the red shirt and we get to have him back, have that shooting. But I'd actually, of the two, I would rather have Rashawn Agee back. To tell you the truth, if you could only pick one, I'd agree with you.

Speaker 3: 38:39

But if you can have both of them, I say why not?

Speaker 2: 38:42

Yeah, absolutely, and also he's going to be old.

Speaker 3: 38:44

You've got that old man strength down there Well what's really so cool to see for him is, you know, I was talking to a friend about this the other day and my friend was saying if you're not a shooter, you're not a shooter. You know, you've played so much basketball in your life, up to the point of your senior year in college. If you can't shoot threes by that point, you're just not a shooter.

Speaker 3: 39:09

I said look at A, look at ag, this guy who basically, you know, was poor to non-existent three-point shooter came in and hit uh 40 of his threes on like a appreciable volume, you know, yeah, like an insignificant volume. And he really changed some games with his shooting not just with the points he was putting out absolutely with the way that. Then he was able to change the defense and then Claude comes in and he's able to take advantage of that.

Speaker 2: 39:36

No, that's you know 100. True, he's a example of a guy who just sort of whittled away at that skill you know first, probably, like you know first in practice, and and then you know slowly but surely, just unveiling it little by little in in games and finally, uh, coming to its full flowering, uh, towards the end of the season, when you just sort of uh, you know there was like that stretch where he had the, he had the big explosion. Or you know those two or three games where he was like making all those threes and then there was sort of like this reversion and you're like, oh, okay, I think it was the game where he went over over four from three ucla, he had an airball hat trick actually yeah, he had three airballs right, so it was kind of like, okay, you know, slow your roll there, buddy.

Speaker 2: 40:20

But to his credit he came back and showed that that the first, the first explosion of of makes wasn't a fluke and finished it strong 41%. I mean, that's nothing to sneeze at there.

Speaker 1: 40:34

Sorry real quick. On that too I'm comfortable. It's not a fluke, because if you look at, basically he has such a nice arch on his free throws and they're so pure, the guy is a shooter. This isn't just like some guy that line drives it and is getting lucky Right, it's a really nice arch he has to his shot.

Speaker 2: 40:49

Yeah, I totally agree. Then you've got Josh Cohen who, I think, through everything that happened this year he was pretty positive, played hard. He shot 61% a team leading 61% on the year, 76% for free throws, 6.2 boards, 2.5 rebounds a game. Because of the nature of, I think, the roster structure, he never really had a chance to assert himself. He had a chance, I should say, but it was difficult for him to assert himself as had a chance, I should say but, but it was.

Speaker 2: 41:28

It was difficult for him to assert himself as a consistent starter and finding a role on this team because he's primarily an offensive player and he's really a guy that needs to be fed and need needs to be part of, like, I think, a lot of movement going on on offense and as the the offense sort of metamorphosed into is that right, metamorphosized, Metamorphosized, I think, metamorphosized as the offense sort of evolved into one in which was just these ball dominant guards. I think he was, you know, odd man out there and I think, but I still think he didn't seem like he sulked too much. It seemed like when he did come in, he played hard. So kudos to Josh Cohen for, you know, sticking it on the season. What do you guys think about Josh Cohen's contribution this year?

Speaker 3: 42:25

I think as his scoring production kind of went down, as during Big Ten play, his effort started to really go up and there were some moments where he was grabbing offensive rebounds just on pure effort, just really just battling for the ball, and I really appreciated being able to watch that. I think it was clear that it was a great challenge for him to play defense in the Big Ten and even at times to score with his usual post moves. But he really just tried his hardest and made some positive plays when he was on the floor.

Speaker 1: 43:08

Agree, you know, even though his production went down, he stayed efficient um throughout the season, actually ended the season as the as the second most efficient um offensive player. We extend the roster beyond just that. You know the the season end rotation um. But yeah, I think the this is a team that struggled defensively and I think this was kind of like the opposite of the battlefield promotion. I think it was the battlefield casualty, where they said, okay, we just can't, there's enough problems on defense as it is and there's only so much we can triage around and you're beyond that critical mass.

Speaker 2: 43:48

That's a great way to put it.

Speaker 2: 43:52

Clark Slackert we talked a lot about how at some point there would be a Slackert game and he nearly pulled off really one of the great reserve clutch performances in USC basketball history because he came in as a starter after Desmond Claude went out against Michigan State, came up against Northwestern on the road 24 points on 9 of 11, shooting 4 of 4 three-pointers, just really came out like a boss and just showed his stuff.

Speaker 2: 44:26

Clark Slackert you know things might have turned out a little bit differently for him had he got off to a better start, yeah, but I think, as it turned out, by the time he got himself going, the the rotations were kind of set and but I thought he acquitted himself pretty decently for them. For the most part his numbers weren't great. He ended up shooting 43%, 33% from three-point land, but of course a lot of that was he got off to a really rough start, so he shot pretty well over the last stretch. Only 68% from the free throw line, but a lot of that. I think if he played 30 minutes he'd probably shoot 80%, right, I just think that's probably a product of just uh, uneven, uneven playing time and and and uh, sometimes how that can affect other parts of your game. So what do you guys think about clark slacker and, uh, his contribution to the team this year?

Speaker 3: 45:25

you know, he, we, we got the clark slackeracker game where he went totally unconscious against Northwestern. In my opinion I would push back a little bit against the narrative that, well, the team would have won a lot more if he would have gotten more playing time. I mean, even in that Northwestern game he missed, along with Abo, a few key free throws that might have actually just won that game. And then, you know, he had that turnover at the end of the Minnesota game. People argued that he got fouled, but nonetheless he kind of lost that game because all he needed to do was inbound it and hit free throws. At that point he turned it over and he scored like the one that you can't do Right. So when we you know those moments just kind of give me a little bit of pause. Fair enough, that Northwestern game was super fun to watch and he did continue to hit some shots beyond that.

Speaker 1: 46:28

I cannot disagree with anything that you said, however, and apologies since I missed this morning's production meeting. He said sarcastically Apologies if this steps over another segment.

Speaker 2: 46:40

We had donuts and coffee In my honor. Thank you.

Speaker 1: 46:46

I want to see this in the postseason game. I want to see this in the postseason game. I want to see Clark Slacker start and run it around there like Bob Cousy, just to let Claude get off the ball and see how that goes. What is there to lose? Literally just see what happens that's a great point.

Speaker 2: 47:04

They could put him in instead of Abo, because you kind of like you obviously don't have the size. They could put him in instead of Abo, right, because you kind of like you obviously don't have the size, but you get better ball handling.

Speaker 1: 47:17

I think Sky's head is going to explode here.

Speaker 3: 47:21

The issue with that is Bob Cousy, one of the greatest point guards of all time.

Speaker 2: 47:27

But he can only dribble with his right hand.

Speaker 3: 47:30

They tried Slacker on the ball at the beginning of the season. It didn't really seem like it worked and he played a lot better later in the season, probably because I think he was off the ball more aside from maybe creating his own shot at times, but not trying to shoulder the burden of setting up the whole offense. I just, I don't know. Maybe I'm the contrarian here, but I don't quite. He's hot given the ball.

Speaker 2: 47:57

I don't have a I don't, I'm not, I'm not of the position that he should have been starting all year. I'm definitely not one of those people at all, but for now, just this one game.

Speaker 1: 48:08

What's the downside? Oh, it's going to be tough to watch basketball. We've been dealing with that for a while, okay.

Speaker 2: 48:14

Yeah, I don't even know who's going to be playing here, that's true yeah, Kevin Patton Jr, who by all accounts, is not going to be with the team next year, is what everyone's saying. I actually think he's a promising player. I like watching him. I think he's a promising player. I like watching him. I think he's shot 56%. He was the best finisher on the team down low decent 3 point shooter at 35%. Not the best free throw shooter, but you know he could. He was actually 3rd on the team in blocks with like almost second, almost tied for second.

Speaker 2: 48:50

I'm not, this was not a shot blocking team. I think this was like one of the worst shot blocking teams in USC history. But for a guy who really didn't play all that much, only averaged eight minutes a game to be to be third on the team in in block shots just kind of goes to show you the you know he only had 218 minutes all season, right, so it just goes to show you just the volume that he was able to block shots at. So intriguing player. But there's a lot of guys out there like that. You know I would have wanted him to stay, but good luck to him, Assuming he is, of course, going on to somewhere else.

Speaker 3: 49:33

And there's always surprises. You know, I wouldn't be surprised if he did end up staying, but yeah, that has been the rumor floated by several people that he plans to enter the portal. He had some real highlight plays that were super exciting. He played really well against Maryland, but he was a little undisciplined. You know. I think there's still some facets of the game he's learning, which is why he didn't play more minutes.

Speaker 1: 49:57

He kind of played like a freshman for a lot of time of the season but it seemed like he had an extended moment there where he was, he was getting production and then it it almost seemed to kind of close, with Agee really coming on and cementing himself as like a legitimate I don't know whatever legitimate finished product that John Agee is today.

Speaker 2: 50:21

Yeah, Well, you know it's the 10,000-hour rule. There you go, spend 10,000 hours doing this stuff. But you know, with Patton it was interesting because he he was a high volume shot blocker. You know he's a decent outside shooter, decent handles, decent defender. Like you said, sky, uh, discipline issues as far as like being disciplined on defense and maybe you know learning to to do the off run, the offense better, but certainly no major like you don't look at him and say, man, that guy cannot do this right, uh, necessarily, like he's got. He's got some, given his size uh and measurables. He's got some uh great skills and I'm skills and hopefully he stays.

Speaker 2: 51:12

Then you've got Matt Noling, who is sort of like a guy we never really got to know. He got hurt relatively early in the season, took a long time to come back, finally did come back, eased in very slowly, ended up shooting 58% not really much of a factor as a free throw shooter or a three-point shooter, and didn't really. You know, he actually was also tied for third on the team of blocked shots. He had twice as many minutes as Kevin Patton, though Probably a player who, like I, would venture to guess that in 2035, we'll be like, oh yeah, he was on the team, wasn't he? Charles the Charles bugs, oh God.

Speaker 3: 52:00

He seemed like he was going to kind of be a really intriguing do it all point forward type, like a triple single dreamaymond Green type of guy, and I think it was a combination of the injury and just like the step up in play coinciding step up in competition, rather that. You know it was tough. It was tough. Some of the stuff, the shots that he was getting easily and making early in the season, weren't happening later in the season until actually the last two or three games actually. He's playing better.

Speaker 1: 52:37

It's weird, when he got hurt, that injury seemed very, very vital because he was a strong rotation player and it just seemed like he never got that roll back and probably coming back from a, from a you know, a concussion, which I think is what he was diagnosed with, that's, that's gamey, and it's tough. And then to you know, as you said, come back in conference season when you're you haven't had the chance to ease into it. That can be really tough. How about Yale losing him? And didn't Wolf go to Yale too? And they made the tournament still. My goodness, what a machine.

Speaker 3: 53:15

Knowing he did have some concussion symptoms, I think, but he also supposedly had a knee sprain. Oh my gosh, it wasn't really clear. Muscle was really cagey about answering any questions about it.

Speaker 2: 53:28

Yeah, yeah, certainly didn't seem to be himself all the time out there, especially coming back. This is a guy who's got a pretty cagey post-up works around the basket pretty well. There were some times in the last few games, as the season closed out, where he started playing a bit more, but from an offensive standpoint he was very reticent to try to do anything with his back to the basket. Um, he was just mainly focused on not making mistakes. Um, which brings us to our next player, uh, isaiah elohim, who does not seem to be with the team or has not been with the team. I haven haven't heard yet.

Speaker 2: 54:08

Uh, what if there's any specific reason for that, whether there's any family issues, whether it's personal issues, whether he was sick, or whether this is a sign that a look that he is going to try to apply his elsewhere? Um, I'm not sure you know, maybe maybe he I don't know where else he would. Um, I'm not sure you know, maybe he I don't know where else he would be able to sell himself, in the sense that he didn't really do a whole lot as a freshman. But he's obviously a very talented kid and a smart kid and certainly the excuse could easily be there, which is that it's really hard to carve out playing time on a roster just filled with guys who've been, you know, playing, since he barely had armpit hair.

Speaker 3: 54:56

Yeah, that was. You know he was not pictured with the team during the Big Ten tournament. He hasn't played since Purdue, I believe, which was over a month ago Purdue, not the Big Ten tournament game, but at Purdue and he played quite well in that game. Career high. I think, yeah, the thing watching him was I really loved his energy and he seemed like a pretty smart player, but I couldn't pinpoint anything that he was like particularly well at, and we didn't see him play a ton you know, but like is he a shooter.

Speaker 3: 55:36

He didn't strike me as like a two guard, At least he didn't play that way. He played more like a forward kind of like an undersized forward, yeah, a small wing, yeah. So he probably would shoot more and I think shoot fairly well at a higher volume, but um he's kind of a chance this year.

Speaker 2: 55:55

he's kind of a slow burn kind of guy, is kind of the way I. I see him right. He's not wesley yates coming in, you know um turn it, cranking up the kettle to the highest level, you know he's just he's just just going to simmer and keep getting hotter as his career goes on. I think he's got excellent physical tools. He's a smart player and plays hard and seems like a really good kid as well. It's just a matter of a numbers game and you can only have so many minutes, so many guys playing at once and there's only so many opportunities to be able to do that as a true freshman. So if he leaves totally understandable, this is in this day and age of college basketball Even though I think he's going to be a good player, I don't think he's like. I think he's better than Charles O'Bannon was, you know as a freshman.

Speaker 1: 56:52

You know what?

Speaker 2: 56:53

I mean. So certainly this is a guy who I think just needs some seasoning, just needs the right opportunity. It's really hard, I mean you look how hard it was for guys like Clark Slackard, who averaged 18 points a game, and for Matt Noling, who averaged 11, and.

Speaker 2: 57:06

Bryce Pope, who averaged 11, and Bryce Pope, who averaged 18 or 19 or whatever it was for these guys to come in, to have to like figure out how to just come in at some point in the game. And you know just, you're used to coming out there and just playing a lot, starting playing from the start and doing your thing. You got to now come in and try to fit your style into this. So that was hard for a lot of guys and I would imagine it would have been particularly hard for a true freshman.

Speaker 1: 57:35

Yeah, agreed.

Speaker 2: 57:37

Yeah, another true freshman, jalen Shelley, I thought, was probably, I think, more promising than showed more promise than Elohim. Very similar as far as overall numbers and minutes played and all that kind of thing. Shelly I think Shelly was just showed a bit more pop, especially toward the end of the year. After he sat he was, I think he was out with an injury for a while. He came back later in the year and I just thought, thought he showed a lot of pop in his, in his lateral movement, his explosion, his dribble drive. I think this is another guy who, kind of like Elohim, isn't really incredibly strong in one area but isn't really bad at everything. And since he's 6'8", this is sort of what gives him the advantage over Elohim. This is sort of like what kind of gives him the advantage over Elohim, right? Because even if Isaiah is pretty consistent all the way around, I feel like he's still like 6'4", 6'5", whereas Jalen is pretty much the same but 6'8".

Speaker 1: 58:42

Can I ask you guys I'm curious about this because you guys are smarter than me at this specific thing Not everything A fully formed Jalen Shelley? What USC basketball player does he look like? Because I don't know what it is.

Speaker 2: 59:02

I don't know. Does he have to be like somebody? I don't know.

Speaker 1: 59:05

I want to frame a reference.

Speaker 2: 59:06

I'm a numbers guy. How about Drew Peterson that?

Speaker 3: 59:11

is the same name that I thought of too, and he didn't display that kind of ball dominance and ball handling that Drew usually did in his freshman season Shelly didn't this year, I mean, but Musk commented that before the season started he was practicing Shelly at point, and so there may be some potential there in terms of, just like you know, getting some assists and being able to kind of play a little bit of point forward while also having, I would say, more defensive upside than Peterson.

Speaker 2: 59:51

There's nothing wrong with being a guy who can be six, eight, defend, be you know, have long arms, shoot the ball fairly well, pass, handle block shots, do all that stuff. There's nothing wrong with being pretty good at all those things. So Shelly has a chance to be pretty good at all those things.

Speaker 3: 1:00:11

My other comparison that jumped to my mind would be Max on Von Polo if he didn't drive us crazy. I think, that almost fits better probably.

Speaker 1: 1:00:26

Does he have that kind of shot, shelly, that kind of outside shot, because you mentioned two guys that were Different types of Reasonably good behind the line.

Speaker 2: 1:00:39

I think physically they look alike, but I think Shelly's ball handling is so much better than Max's.

Speaker 3: 1:00:46

Well, yeah, that's what I'm saying. It's like I think Shelly can can stroke it. Actually I must have complimented him on that before the season started.

Speaker 2: 1:00:58

I think he's.

Speaker 3: 1:00:59

I think he's somebody that we should try to keep hopefully you know, and I think, I think, I think he's somebody that we should try to keep hopefully.

Speaker 1: 1:01:06

I think he will stay. Yeah, are we looking next year at Jalen Shelley just like doing these drives to the paint going airborne and then looking around saying now do I do with the ball? And just trying to find somebody to whom he can pass it as he's about to go under the basket? Is that the Drew Peterson analogy that we're looking at here? Every, everything else, I mean, if he he can if he wants to be like.

Speaker 2: 1:01:28

If he can do that like Drew did, I'm all for that.

Speaker 1: 1:01:30

Two times two times, okay, 12.

Speaker 2: 1:01:32

I'll take it Bryce Pope, another guy who sort of gets thrown on the dustbin of history a bit, just in the sense that he was part of USC's first class under Eric Musselman, a highly productive player, like many of these guys were at their previous schools and, to his credit, seemed to play hard, found his role, played hard and had some moments in games, but really, just again someone had to get lost in the shuffle of the season for whatever reason. Um, it's not just like, you know, going to trying to figure out how to get how to play at a higher. You know there's all kinds of things how to play at the higher level new competition, uh, new facility. You know you're at a new school, you're at new people, new coaches, everything's new. And then you've got to try to figure out, like, where your skills fit in.

Speaker 2: 1:02:25

And it could be that, just like some guys who ended up coming, uh, the way they adjusted, a lot of the skills were ended up being duplicative or, you know, there weren't like clear winners in certain among certain groups of guys, and so you just sort of had some kind of piecemeal participation, participation on their part. So, again, like a lot of these other guys. Bryce played hard and you know, I guess he's the eighth or ninth guy. So our ninth, ninth or 10th guy. So what is that much you can expect when you're that far down in the rotation?

Speaker 3: 1:03:03

Yeah, we never really got the Bryce Pope game. No, the closest we got, I think, was he scored seven, I think, against some team like Southern, he had five against Montana state. Okay, so I oversold him a little bit.

Speaker 2: 1:03:17

He did have. He did have seven, a big 17 minutes Against against, against, against Purdue.

Speaker 3: 1:03:22

Yeah, and he, you know, he, he made 17 minutes against Purdue.

Speaker 3: 1:03:24

Yeah, you know he made some shots against Purdue. He actually looked good in the first half against Purdue, I think. You know. I think in some ways he should have played more. But the issue with him positionally is that he is a pure two guard. Like I don't think he gives you any combo guard like Wesley Yates does. Certainly he's not going to necessarily take the place of Wesley Yates and you know, if you sub him out for Claude, like he doesn't bring any of that playmaking.

Speaker 2: 1:03:55

So I think in terms of a fit with the roster.

Speaker 3: 1:03:58

It just ended up being a little bit tough for him.

Speaker 2: 1:04:00

Yeah, you know, like when I see him, he kind of the way he plays as an offensive player, it just reminds me of like an out-of-control kite a bit. Just, you know, when you lose control of the kite and you can't like get a hold of it. And you know it kind of worked for him at UC San Diego. But yeah, it's just one of those rolls of the dice that didn't necessarily work well, didn't work out from a personal standpoint I don't know. I mean he would have had to have been I don't know who he could have displaced as a starter or even for significant minutes. But good for Bryce Pope for sticking it out, being positive, of course, harrison Hornery played in seven games. Didn't start any games, 21 minutes total on the season. The end of an era for young Harrison. He seems like he's been at the school for a long, long time. And that's it for him. Thoughts on the last holdover from the Andy Enfield era.

Speaker 3: 1:05:15

Well, yeah, I think it's so. The opposite of slacker, where some people say a slacker show played more than two and one more. I think.

Speaker 3: 1:05:24

Harry probably deserved more minutes. Granted, I didn't see him a ton in practice, but I did see him in practice. He didn't like totally flash, but in his previous seasons he was a fairly solid post defender. Yeah, that was the biggest weakness, I think, on this usc team. And ag was not terrible, but he's just so undersized that, yeah, he's playing against seven footers. I think it's really tough for him, whereas harry maybe could have been a little bit game to to bang on defense. On offense, he, he's just a pure shooter. I wish we could have seen a little bit more of him, but I don't know if it would have changed the trajectory of the season. I'm really happy he was here and that he got some value out of his senior season.

Speaker 1: 1:06:17

Yep wanted to stay at USC, that's good enough for me. Exactly, to some extent, if you look at USC, that's good enough for me.

Speaker 2: 1:06:22

Exactly and to some extent, if you look at Harrison Hornery and you look at the trajectory of college players' seasons, if you divide up the players in groups, there are guys who still have this dream of making something of themselves as a college basketball player and they spend most of their college career whether it's one year, two year, three year, four years chasing that dream right. And these guys are the ones that have that mentality. Then you get the guys who are already pretty much aware early on that they've got an inside leg to that and they're mentally focused on sort of shaping their college experience to support that as much as possible. Then you get guys like harrison hornery who basically, like you know, he obviously had hoops dreams, just like a lot of these guys come out of high school, but I would say by the time his sophomore year ended, there's a different mentality coming from him. He's part of that group of guys which is like uh, you know, I'm going. This is like where I go to school, I play basketball, I'm having a great time, having a great experience. I'm going to do the best I can. I'm never going to. I'm not going to make money playing basketball. Not only do I, am I not going to play make money playing basketball. I'm not even sure if I want to make money playing basketball anymore. You know what I mean.

Speaker 2: 1:07:39

And I think like, to some extent, harrison was just one of those guys where it's like he had already come to terms with the idea that he wasn't going to be what he, maybe the player he thought he was going to be.

Speaker 2: 1:07:49

And everyone, everyone reaches that point at some point in their lives. Uh, not everyone, but you know, most college basketball players reach the point where they're like oh yeah, I'm not going to be a. You know, this is my last year, or I've got, you know, this is it, I'm not going to do this anymore. So that's sort of, I think, where Harrison was, unlike a lot of the other guys on the team, right, who, I think if you go look up and down the roster, if you look like where might Harrison have fit in, you've got a bunch of guys who are like super hungry, still still like trying to prove that they can play at the college level, still prove they can play at this level, the Big Ten level, and try to make enough name for themselves so they can make money so hard to compete with that.

Speaker 3: 1:08:31

You know, what's interesting about Harry is I remember seeing an interview with him in either his freshman or sophomore year where he basically was asked about playing basketball in Australia and he said like, yeah, I would love to do that, I hope to do that someday. And I think, to your point, chris, he kind of you know if he goes on and plays professionally in Australia, he probably has an inside lane on that.

Speaker 2: 1:09:01

Oh, it wouldn't be hard to play because there's um in addition to that. There's like the national. There's like the nbl there, yeah, which is like the nba, but there's also like in each state, whether it's, uh, you know, victoria or queensland or west australia there's there's like state basketball leagues. My brother played like 15 years in one of those state basketball leagues. Oh, wow, yeah, and what they do is they have um, they have native Australians, and then you're allowed to have two imports per team. So he could go back and he, he, he would be able to play in those. You know, it wouldn't be they, they wouldn't pay you a lot of money, like it's kind of like, you know, decent little gig and then you have to have a job in the offseason, kind of thing. But he can certainly have a lot of fun doing that and certainly would probably be. I mean, he could probably play at the NBL level if he really wanted to in Australia. I mean, it's gotten to be a really good league, but he would have a chance for sure.

Speaker 3: 1:09:54

Yeah, so I think he was just kind of satisfied with if that is my future, I'd love to do that.

Speaker 2: 1:10:03

Yeah, that's a good insight on his attitude. Okay, so that was a look at the team as it happened. It looks like Whoa, whoa, whoa, did we miss somebody? Yeah, you did there you go, come on. Are you going to JD me? I'm just.

Speaker 1: 1:10:27

I just want to make a couple points Now. He had the soft underbelly of the schedule, if you will, so he by far was the most efficient offensive player.

Speaker 2: 1:10:37

Yeah, terrence Williams, I was going to talk about him on the next group here, which was the guys who we expect to come back.

Speaker 1: 1:10:45

Okay, is that his own group? Is this like the Charles Buggs wing of the USC? No, I'm just saying because. Next, year.

Speaker 2: 1:10:54

Potentially Desmond Claude, wesley Yates, probably Terrence Williams. So that's three guys there. Maybe Rashawn Agee. That's four guys. I would say Jalen Shelley is five. If I had to guess I would say we're starting from that five. Maybe somebody can outbid Claude and Ori Yates away, but I kind of think that we're going to make them a priority. Maybe Rashawn thinks they can get better money in the market, who knows? Because he certainly acquitted himself well this year, showed he can play at this level.

Speaker 3: 1:11:30

I'd be surprised if he wants to come back and USC doesn't take care of him somewhat. It did feel like he really enjoyed his time here and he kind of blossomed here. One thing of note that is very interesting about the ncaa rules next season scholarship cap is being moved from 13 to 15, so you can have 15 legitimate scholarship players. Yeah, however, the roster cap is also 15. So that means essentially no walk-ons.

Speaker 2: 1:12:04

Right, yeah, they're getting rid of. It's kind of too bad, it's kind of the end of an era. They're getting rid of walk-ons, both football and basketball, other sports as well. Yeah, I think I don't know what the value is in having 15 guys on scholarship, to be honest, but they're going to do it, I'm sure yeah, but having 15 guys on scholarship, to be honest, but they're gonna do it, I'm sure yeah. But if, like, if you're the 14th, like what was the? I mean, if you just want guys to scrimmage against, I mean, like you're not gonna. If you're like not in that top 10, you're just never gonna. Like five guys are just not gonna play pretty much.

Speaker 3: 1:12:37

Look, ucla had two, uh like nationally ranked four-star guys redshirt this year. Yeah, I mean, I think if you can convince players to come, you'll take every single one of them. You never know for injuries and this and that.

Speaker 2: 1:12:52

Would you rather?

Speaker 3: 1:12:53

have your 15th scholarship player starting, or Eric Strangis.

Speaker 2: 1:12:59

Yeah, I mean, I've got the KO reference coming up. Oh man, yeah. I mean. I mean, oh man, no. I mean that's true, but I guess it's like I guess, how often are you in that situation where you need to play your 13th player, much less someone who's going to be your 15th player, is kind of what I'm saying and then just to go almost over the top on Sky.

Speaker 1: 1:13:20

Well, that's impossible with that one. Then we don't have an Abdul El-Maghbari game back in 2001. That's true. That was true, the legend. You were cutting your teeth then, literally.

Speaker 3: 1:13:34

I was in Portland Oregon.

Speaker 2: 1:13:37

You're gleaming your father's eye. Okay, so we've got those. You know ostensibly some group variation on that group coming back. And then, of course, one of the top recruiting classes in the nation, elijah Arenas, who should be somebody who contributes right away LZ Harrington, a great local point guard. Also Jerry Easter, who I think actually Harrington's more like a combo guard, really almost a true shooting guard, maybe even a little bit of a wing. But I think Easter of the bunch has a chance to be a legitimate point guard option in college.

Speaker 2: 1:14:15

But Muss has his work cut out for him in the portal to try to get some bigs he's going to need. I think he needs to get three bigs and one ball handler is kind of how I look at it. How do you guys assess USC's needs in the portal? I mean, cause, here's the thing I'm pretty sure, unless it's something where it just kind of falls into place, it sounds like, according to my sources, that we're going to focus our big men recruiting in the portal versus in high school this year. So you know, again with the big men, if you can get these guys who are like just old and crusty big old and crusty.

Speaker 3: 1:14:56

That can go a long way in the big old and crusty Big Ten. Yeah, I think if you retain AG you might be able to get away with two big recruits. You could certainly bring in three, I think in that case. Your third is probably like a Bubakar type who maybe has some flashes, maybe plays, maybe doesn't. But, that is just absolutely imperative. So it'll be really interesting to see who SC brings in. There's already been a few names floated, and I'm sure there will be many more.

Speaker 2: 1:15:27

There needs to be at least one MF-er though.

Speaker 3: 1:15:31

I think I know what you mean and I agree.

Speaker 2: 1:15:34

No, I mean, I feel like you can't have, like maybe you can like. I think the minimum threshold for the next big has to be like someone who's at least as good as Agee. Oh yeah, yeah. Well, size, size, I think.

Speaker 1: 1:15:50

Size and like some ability around the basket some post game.

Speaker 2: 1:15:52

Yeah, we need like a, which he doesn't have to all his credit.

Speaker 3: 1:15:55

And you know he stopped trying, which I think really Right, actually helped his game.

Speaker 2: 1:16:01

Yeah, the circumstances of the season were just not conducive toward him developing his postgame. Certainly our offense wasn't something that was feeding the post, but yeah, some kind of 6'10" just like anchor down low. I think someone who is just a real beast on the boards and on defense is going to be really an imperative.

Speaker 1: 1:16:26

Okay, I mean, every team wants one of those, right, well, right. So what one player that we went against, that would be realistic, that we could get in the portal, would you say? Would be that analog?

Speaker 2: 1:16:57

You know, maybe like somebody who I would take, who, who is not Kohler? Is that his name? What Cheddar he's a? A you're muted, sky, sky, you're muted.

Speaker 3: 1:17:14

I didn't say a whole lot of anything anyways.

Speaker 2: 1:17:16

You looked very indignant, you were very indignant.

Speaker 3: 1:17:19

All I said was I don't think Kohler's who you're thinking of. He was the guy that was recruited by USC, but he didn't play well against SC in that game.

Speaker 2: 1:17:29

They have another big, I don't remember his name.

Speaker 3: 1:17:30

His name's like Branson or Braxton.

Speaker 2: 1:17:32

Well, that's the guy I was thinking of, the guy who at least was he's a West Coast guy. I'm trying to look at guys who are potential guys who would be open to do, would have some kind of connection to Southern California. Jackson Kohler, 6'9", 245, had a decent season last year. This year, I should say, what did he average? He averaged eight points, eight boards.

Speaker 3: 1:18:08

He plays more from the outside, from my recollection. I think SC needs a banger rim protector guy who can block shots and score in the post.

Speaker 2: 1:18:21

A rim protector, a shot blocker, who can score in the post. That's exceedingly rare. But I was just trying to think piecemeal. You can get a guy like Kohler, who is a skilled big, who's also. I think Kohler hasn't had a chance. I think he's actually pretty good in the post.

Speaker 3: 1:18:39

I see what you're saying.

Speaker 2: 1:18:40

And then you get a guy who's like the defensive rim protector, who maybe doesn't, he's just like maybe a good finisher, right, like you need some guy who can create a little bit down low or, you know, inside out, like ag, does, does, or um, uh, you know, or like uh, I don't know, but just, and then. And then you need a guy who's just kind of the enforcer, right, I don't know, I don't think you necessarily need. You need a guy who's just kind of the enforcer. I don't think you necessarily need two enforcers, you just need someone who has to be accounted for down there offensively. I think they don't have to be fantastic, but they have to be accounted for. You can't just leave them alone. That's kind of how I see it. They've got to be somebody who has to be held accountable offensively, hi.

Speaker 3: 1:19:26

Mario.

Speaker 1: 1:19:28

Yeah, I don't know. That's why I asked you kind of go down this conversation and my thought process ends up being literally every team would take one of those in a heartbeat. So how reasonable is it to try to get one of those? But then again, we did get Josh, josh Morgan, which doesn't check all those boxes, but I'd like to have Josh Morgan on this team well, there's some teams that already have that.

Speaker 2: 1:19:49

So there's some teams that already have it, or some teams that have it more than one, or some teams that fall into the situation where I've got two guys who are duplicative skill sets and I can only play one and one wants to. So those are the guys we're looking at. We're looking at someone who has some kind of like. You know, everyone wants them, but we're going to try to outbid. There's going to be somebody out there who, through the combination of muscle and saying, look, we've got a great recruiting class coming back, we've got some other good pieces, we just need some bigs, and we just need some bigs. And then I would actually to me I'm not even as much like worried about the point guard position in a sense, because I think that like it wasn't an entirely successful experiment with Claude as point.

Speaker 2: 1:20:35

But I think bringing in Easter and Harrington, who are both like ball handlers or at least Easter is a really good ball handler you can relieve some of the pressure Like you can have yes you can have Easter, be like the if he can handle it, like he has the potential to be the primary ball handler and then just have, like Claude, playing off the ball or playing, or you know, playing, a three guard offense with with Yates potentially, and that takes some of the pressure, and a three-guard offense with Yates potentially, and that takes some of the pressure, and then you kind of mix and match just to kind of rotate him in so he's taking the pressure off them, especially like in situations where they're pressing.

Speaker 3: 1:21:09

Early in the season it seemed like was trying to play a two-point guard offense with Saint and Claude and it just, I think, was a little bit too much of a burden on Saint to be a primary point guard like that yeah, although he was great at finding guys but just to initiate the offense as a ball handler, I think it was a bit much. But with. Easter and Claude and Yates. You know, especially if he tightens up his handle a bit, you really could have something.

Speaker 2: 1:21:37

Yeah, there's a saying when you play two guys at point guard who aren't point guards, you don't have any point guards.

Speaker 1: 1:21:45

I thought they said that about quarterbacks. Come on, I think you're just making stuff up now.

Speaker 2: 1:21:51

See, I think you're the point guard is the quarterback of the hardwood.

Speaker 1: 1:21:54

True, yeah, this must have been covered at the donuts. We need that. I missed. Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 2: 1:21:58

Well, that's our wrap-up of the close of the season. That's our wrap-up of the roster and, of course, looking ahead to next year, as we get more specific ideas of who might be on the roster next year, who we're looking at, we'll talk about that more. We'll get into some evaluations and try to cover any news that comes up. Of course, usc, I guess, is playing April 1st against Tulane in this tournament called College Basketball Crown. I tried to get information about it but there's just not really much information about it. I just, you know, I don't really have, I don't really like. I like basketball, you know what I mean, but I don't like basketball for basketball's sake, necessarily. I like basketball with purpose, because even an exhibition game or a preseason game has purpose, because you're seeing new teams and you're seeing how the teams are going to look. But a postseason exhibition, which is all this really amounts to, I don't see the point.

Speaker 3: 1:22:55

I'll tell you what the point is, supposedly the way I interpreted it. The two final teams get $500,000 each, and I don't think that's for the program, I think that's for the players. Ooga, ooga. So yeah. Now the thing is listen. That's all the information I have. What I read was $500,000 in NIL prize, which means the players get it. Now how do you divide that? I think SC has 19 players. Does that mean each guy gets like?

Speaker 2: 1:23:28

25K JD.

Speaker 3: 1:23:30

Plough gets 25K, or is it like scholarship players get? I don't know, but that's the incentive and I think when the brain trust at Fox came up with this idea, they were hoping to make the games interesting with a little bit of cash. Jesus Christ, this is the weird thing about this game.

Speaker 3: 1:23:53

For those who don't know which is everybody, this game? They have some kind of contract which I guess is I don't know if it's a basketball or football contract uh, but you know, fox sports, with the big 12, the big 10 and the big east, and each of those conferences are mandated to send two teams to this cbc tournament. Um, send two teams to this cbc tournament. Um, rutgers and ohio state. I don't know if they were formally invited to the cbc, they finished ahead of usc and they both declined all off season or all post season play, so they didn't want to play in the CBC. And furthermore, these contracts that Fox Sports have also prohibit the Big Ten from playing in the NIT.

Speaker 3: 1:24:50

So we were all speculating about the NIT. We didn't know at the time, actually, that zero Big Ten teams would even be in the NIT at all. So SC ended up, you know, and Nebraska I don't. So I don't really understand at all. So SC ended up, you know, and Nebraska, I don't really understand. Does that mean that Iowa and Northwestern and Minnesota all declined to play in the CBC At a certain point? You have to start strong-arming teams because this is literally you have to have some people from the Big Ten.

Speaker 2: 1:25:20

All this talk of bonuses and cash prizes and NIL and strong army. It just warms the cockles of my heart. It's what I think about when I think of college basketball. It's why I watch the sport.

Speaker 1: 1:25:33

Guys, I've got to say, as salesmen, you two flat out suck. Okay, come on, do better. I mean I'm excited.

Speaker 2: 1:25:43

I don't know I am, I just want to see, I'm going to see Bob Cousy game. You know, pay me money uh to to, uh to inform people on ST sports. You know a sports inform informer, if you will, uh, uh, and I and I will do it.

Speaker 3: 1:25:59

but uh, I ain't giving anybody any ideas anymore and I will do it, but I ain't giving anybody any ideas anymore. So another interesting fact about this tournament is that, out of the 16 teams, six of them are former.

Speaker 3: 1:26:15

Pac-12 teams, which is just kind of weird. You have Colorado, which USC is in the bracket against. If they win their first game against Tulane football flashbacks, oh my God, sc would play the winner of Colorado and somebody else I don't remember. You also have Oregon state and Utah and Washington state, so they kind of went for some a brand name recognition in a way, I guess. Yeah, um, pretty interesting.

Speaker 2: 1:26:40

Well, you know what?

Speaker 3: 1:26:41

I'll give it a shot, I'll deign to watch, I guess, and see, I'm looking forward to it, I think it's fun and I think they're going to try to promote this and if SC plays well, it will be very good exposure for the program.

Speaker 2: 1:26:53

Well, I'll tell you what. Let's do this, since if this is something that USC is looking to increase exposure, I'll have to go and check in with the sports information department and try to see if we can get someone to come on the show. Yes, talk about the game.

Speaker 3: 1:27:08

That would be great actually.

Speaker 2: 1:27:09

Let's see if we can do that.

Speaker 3: 1:27:11

The wrinkle in that, chris. This is highly circumstantial evidence here. But as of the recording of this pod, eric Musselman nor any of his players. Well, I take that back. Harry Horner reposted USC's announcement, but Claude and Yates and Thomas and AD no one is posting like can't wait to play in the CDC. They've been posting other stuff and not about this. I don't know if that means anything.

Speaker 2: 1:27:35

It's funny. I don't know when the decisions are going to be made, but I feel like if you were going to be coming back next year, maybe, or maybe, like you, if you want to come back next year, or if you are willing to come back next year for the right price, but you also don't want to play in this, in this tournament, and maybe get yourself hurt or just do something. You might just be like oh, I don't know if I'm coming back or not, and then wait until the game is played and be like okay, I'm coming back. You know what I mean.

Speaker 1: 1:28:03

You're a creative guy. What is wrong with you? They should make this like a squid game kind of thing. It's like, look, whenever the starting five has the least amount of points, you're off the program.

Speaker 3: 1:28:14

Just like you know, I think you've hit upon a great pitch to future USC basketball recruits. Playing a squid game of college basketball why even?

Speaker 2: 1:28:25

have the NCAA tournament. Why not just make it a big squid game? Instead of having a lame trophy at the end, there should be this massive pile of money being suspended from the roof.

Speaker 3: 1:28:38

Every time a team loses, the pot increases Exactly.

Speaker 1: 1:28:42

I know you want to wrap up here. I have to just like former Trojans in the news. Okay, yes, ozia Sellers gets an IT bid at Stanford. Congratulations to him. He had a really good season. By the way, what happened at Stanford? An?

Speaker 2: 1:28:55

IT bid for Ozia Sellers. Oh, okay, yes.

Speaker 1: 1:28:57

Okay, vince the Prince gets a Big East championship. Congratulations, vince. Wow and most of all, most dear to our hearts, as we shared offline here Mongolian Basketball League MVP Byron Wesley, everybody, how about that?

Speaker 3: 1:29:13

Byron Wesley and the crown jewel of Kevin O'Neill's. You know if you can. They say, if you can play on the mean streets, of Ulaanbaatar.

Speaker 2: 1:29:22

you can play anywhere.

Speaker 3: 1:29:23

Yes, Mark, you neglected to mention Aaron and Paige. Cbc bid.

Speaker 1: 1:29:30

Oh, I missed it, I'm sorry, my bad.

Speaker 2: 1:29:33

I'm pretty sure.

Speaker 3: 1:29:33

Cincinnati's in the field.

Speaker 2: 1:29:37

Yeah, and you know, Andy Enfield's recruiting class is right there with Eric Musselman's recruiting class as far as the rankings go.

Speaker 3: 1:29:45

They're a number one seed in the NIT actually.

Speaker 2: 1:29:49

You know, I think if you were looking at things objectively, I would say that Andy Enfield had the better year. He won round one. Yeah, he won one round one, and he went to a place that hadn't won as much recently so as USC had. So, all right, well, I guess that's a hour and 30. That should be sufficient to wrap up things on the year. We, of course, are going to be coming back from time to time to update. Well, of course we'll. We'll do a podcast surrounding this April fool's day game coming up and we'll see. We'll see who we can get to come on. Maybe we'll get a surprise guest. We'll figure it out and we'll talk about hopefully we get some news on who may or may not be staying and who might be some candidates to be on the roster next year. Do you guys have anything else to add before we cut everyone loose? No, nope, all right, everybody Fight on from this angle. And what do you guys say?

Speaker 1: 1:30:51

Fight on, as always. Fight on everyone. I'm getting right sometimes, Maybe not tonight.

Speaker 2: 1:31:02

Maybe not tonight, maybe not tonight, maybe not tonight, maybe not tonight.